question sound gurus...

[betacloud]

when i use a dirt pedal and have the vol. at like 9:00 and the fuzz dimed, it sounds nice and buzzy, what i want. but when i turn it up, (the vol on the pedal that is), it gets really compressed and flubby.

(ok, this example is NOT a shot at the BAT LSTR, it happens with ALL my fuzzes. the LSTR is just the one mentioned for an example).
example-
lstr fuzz, orange th30 clean channel.
fuzz settings: gain full, tone at 3:00, high at 9:00, volume between 9:00 and 12:00
amp settings: volume at 12:00, both bass and treble at 12:00
PERFECT.

BUT... when i go past that 12:00 on the fuzz volume... flub flub flub.

then i kick off the fuzz and the clean channel is MAD louder than w/fuzz.
so how can i keep it loud and keep that grindy scoop sound?

any ideas?

thanks guys n' gals-
BC

[MannequinRaces]

What kind of amp are you using and are you using a different channel for your clean and fuzz tones? A lot of these issues in my experience are gain staging issues (how loud is your guitar set, how loud is your amp set, where is the volume on your pedals in the signal chain, etc.).

[rfurtkamp]

Sounds like you're overloading the input of the amp.

[betacloud]

What kind of amp are you using and are you using a different channel for your clean and fuzz tones? A lot of these issues in my experience are gain staging issues (how loud is your guitar set, how loud is your amp set, where is the volume on your pedals in the signal chain, etc.).

it's a class a 30 watt orange th30. i only run fuzz on it through the clean channel, through the gain channel, it's more gain channel, less pedal sound coming through.
i generally run it at half power, but it's the same situation at full. the guitar is full vol., the fuzz is the only pedal used.
does that help?

[betacloud]

Sounds like you're overloading the input of the amp.

too much going in?

[betacloud]

also, it has a tube driven effects loop. i go fuzz in/out there and it sounds equally gorgeous, but with a more 'direct' sounding character.
basically using it as a power amp with the stomp box as a pre-amp i'd guess.

but when i crank vol. on the fuzzes, pretty much the same effect.
could it be a 'class-A' thingy? am i thinking too much? should i just play my guitar and shut up?
W.W.F.Z.D.?

[cheesecats]

should i just play my guitar and shut up?

yes

[dubkitty]

Sounds like you're overloading the input of the amp.

any time you turn a fuzz way past unity gain you're risking this.

[betacloud]

Sounds like you're overloading the input of the amp.

any time you turn a fuzz way past unity gain you're risking this.

mmm... unity gain is a mean wine!

[excane]

The solution to this problem is the amp.

For 99% of all gain pedals (OD/fuzz/distortion) they will always sound better through a HIGH powered CLEAN non-master volume amp.
The exception being if the pedal is designed to work with a dirty amp already (like pushing a tubescreamer into the front of a distorted mesa)

For all my pedal demos, I use a Blackstar Artisan 100. It's an EL34 non-master and the amp just does NOT break up unless you're playing at deafening levels. The difference is night and day.... I can take a "bedroom" pedal like some cheapy boss or MXR and this amp makes it sound like a million bucks. A lot of it has to do with the sound NOT compressing like it does with a master volume, channel switching amp.
(My vintage fender Showman is getting some work done, but it does the same job beautifully and will be back to the studio for demos asap)

One more note... stay away from El84 amps. EL84's are the only power tube that provides both current and voltage gain. (this is why it distorts so easily).
6V6, 6L6, 6550, EL34, KT66, KT77, KT88......etc, etc, just provide current gain (power).

Hope this helps

[excane]

If that sounded long winded, just to sum up....

Yes, you need an awesome sounding CLEAN amp with a lot of headroom as not to overload the front end and turn everything to muddy shit.

[betacloud]

If that sounded long winded, just to sum up....

Yes, you need an awesome sounding CLEAN amp with a lot of headroom as not to overload the front end and turn everything to muddy shit.

and the orange is an el84 amp... that explains it perfectly.
so basically if i decide to use the fuzz live... i'll keep the volume low enough to fizz and let the sound guy do the work.

thanks-
carl

[goroth]

Keep the volume on the fuzz at a relatively low volume - switch back and forth from clean to fuzz to clean to fuzz, or download a dB meter for your inevitable smartphone and get the fuzz level the same as the clean. That way you aren't overloading the input. Then push the volume on the amp as hard as you like, while keeping it clean.

- saying what everyone else has said in another way. No disrespectz!

[Chankgeez]

If that sounded long winded, just to sum up....

Yes, you need an awesome sounding CLEAN amp with a lot of headroom as not to overload the front end and turn everything to muddy shit.

No, mr. excane, that was an excellent explanation.

[mathias]

This thread was enlightening. Thanks excane!