Another RAT thread

[backwardsvoyager]

So after never having tried a RAT circuit before i got a RAT2 recently (most recent iteration) and have come to realise at a super low gain setting it's almost the perfect drive/coloration sound i've been looking for (I only use solid state amps now and use way less gain than i used to, so my other favourite dirt pedals have been acting a bit funny cos i was used to the gain boosts working in conjunction with the amp, but i'm not wanting that sound anymore).

I know jack shit about these and am assuming the new ones aren't regarded as sounding as good as older models with different chips and stuff, so i was wondering if anyone knows of any mods that make it a bit less harsh or suck a bit less bass at the more trebly settings (which i love but cos they're a bit harsh on the ears i have to drop the volume a bit so the low end sort of drops out, when i get it sounding less harsh it ends up at a really transparent setting and i'm sort of back to square one), and having more fine control in the lower gain range would be great because i've been keeping the distortion at about 7:30, noise floor improvement would be great too. I'd also have no problem buying a variant or commissioning one from someone here if there's something awesome out there that would suit. The ARC soothsayer looks cool but demos rarely show the sort of settings that i like so i can never really tell.

tl;dr rat mods or variants suited for cutting/articulate lowww gain drive? i'm using a guitar with sliiightly overwound jaguar pickups so people with high gain buckers and stuff might not be experiencing the same characteristics through their setups, my pickup output is pretty low and the amp stays totally clean

Cheers dudes.

[kbit]

Pretty sure the Ruetz Mod is the common low gain mod for Rats, and I think it will get you closer to where you wanna ne.

[frigid midget]

Pretty sure the Ruetz Mod is the common low gain mod for Rats, and I think it will get you closer to where you wanna ne.

This.

If you don't mind the loss of gain/grit, you'll like the little bit of extra low end the Ruetz mod will give you. It's ridicilously easy to do yourself, and doesn't require a lot of tools or skills.

As far as opamps go...I a/b'd a couple different Rats, with different chips. The LM308 version sounds a tiny little bit different than the current version, but imo not necessarily better or anything

[PetZounds]

Yep, a Rat at low gain is one of my favorite sounds.
Only reason I'm selling my Turbo is because I want to try to nab a vintage Rat eventually.

[backwardsvoyager]

thanks guys, i might grab a trimpot and try that ruetz mod to start, sounds about right

how's the Turbo compare to the normal RAT?
i saw a gnarly vintage big box in japan for like under $200 and am kicking myself for not nabbing it

i'm wondering how a RAT would sound with a blend, too

[KaosCill8r]

Try stacking a Ge Fuzz Face into a Ruetz modded Rat with your guitars volume rolled back. One of the nicest overdrive sounds I've heard.

[PetZounds]

thanks guys, i might grab a trimpot and try that ruetz mod to start, sounds about right

how's the Turbo compare to the normal RAT?
i saw a gnarly vintage big box in japan for like under $200 and am kicking myself for not nabbing it

i'm wondering how a RAT would sound with a blend, too

It has different clipping diodes, and I'm pretty sure is louder than a normal Rat.

[tremolo3]

how's the Turbo compare to the normal RAT?

Sounds less compressed and with more balls at the same time, might be due to LED clipping.

[retinal orbita]

On tumblr there is a user named baritones who posted an amazing write up on rat molding, and why the ruetz mod wasn't all as hot as it could be. I really need to find this. It basically desribed a different process to let more bass through.

Let me take a look and I'll report back.

[retinal orbita]

Ahafajsgsha I can't find it. I'll serif I reblogged it.

But without knowing that user personally his tumblr rules and you should follow him.

[The_Active_Conundrum]

I am also a new Rat initiate. I feel dumb for having ignored that entire field of dirt for so long. It isn't even fuzz so I had no excuse.

[chillerthanmost]

Low gain RAT is definitely one of the best sounds through a tube amp. Ruetz mod is great, though once it's set you kinda always just leave it at that setting, at least from my experience.

[frigid midget]

Turbo vs regular: I think there's a youtube clip floating around that compares both side by side. Totally down to taste/preference. I personally like the regular Rat II the most, though the difference isn't even that huge imo.

Vinate Rat: Slightly different shade of Rat, and imo definitely not worth the price of a bitchin boutique peddle with lotsa knobs and tricks and gizmos.

Ruetz Rat with a trim pot: The range is so small, it's not worth it imo. It's not like you'll get tons of bass with the resistor out of the circuit, there's hardly any 'inbetween' setting worth going for a pot instead of a toggle switch. Lots of good tones can be had from a Ruetz'd Rat stacked with a muff or fuzz face or some other fuzz. But at that price point you might as well look into somekind of nice tweakable clone, or just something super versatile like a Dr Scientist The Elements, which covers a ton of different types of fuzzy distortion all on it's own

[retinal orbita]

I found it!!

Darrell rants about the Proco Rat and the ruetz mod.

It’s no secret that the rat is my favourite pedal to ever exist. It’s only drawback is the fact that it can cut a bit too much bottom end for use with low tuned instruments such as baritone guitars, heavily detuned guitars, or bass. The most common mod to remedy this is the ruetz mod. It was the first pedal mod I ever did and the thing that got me hooked on messing around inside pedals. I’ve played around with this mod and the whole rat circuit a ton and am obsessive about getting as much usable low end as possible out of every pedal.
The ruetz mod basically consists of messing around with the 47ohm resistor (R6) that is part of one of two rc (resistor/capacitor) filter networks from the opamps feedback loop to ground. Sometimes this resistor is literally just snipped leaving only the 560ohm/4u7 rc pair to set the gain and low end roll off. Other times that 47 ohm resistor is replaced with a pot. Usually around 1k.
My problem with both versions is that bass is never actually increased. Instead the gain of treble frequencies is actually being decreased by varying degrees. This does give the perception of more low end but in my opinion the decrease of gain in the high end actually robs the rat of its true character. The are tons of “boutique” rat derivatives and rat inspired pedals out there that incorporate some version of the ruetz mod and it boggles my mind.
So what’s the solution?
Well if you know anything about rc filters and especially rc filters in opamp based dirt circuits, you know that the capacitor in that rc pair has an equal impact on the frequencies amplified by the opamp which are then clipped by the diodes. Typically the resistor sets the gain and that resistors relation to the capacitor sets the frequency roll off.
If we look into the rc filters in a rat we’ll see that the 47ohm/2u2 rc pair sets one high pass filter roll off at around 1500hz while the 560ohm/4u7 pair sets a second roll off point around 60hz although with much lower gain.
There are tons of popular mods for equally classic pedals (tubescreamer, distortion plus etc) that involve tweaking the value of the cap in the opamps rc filter to get more bass out of the circuit while leaving gain levels alone.
So why does that seem uncommon in a rat circuit? Why do we ignore the capacitors?
Because I don’t think anyone has written it on the internet yet and a large part of the boutique/DIY pedal community can’t do anything until someone else does it first and tells them how it’s done. The idea of understanding concepts applicable across the board is just beyond some.
So back to these rc pairs…
My favourite version of the ruetz mod was always just replacing the 47ohm resistor with something around 400 ohms which gives a roll off about 180hz while sacrificing a fair bit of gain but If you increase the value of the 2u2 cap instead you can get your low end back without sacrificing ANY gain. 22uf will give you a roll off of around 150hz which is low enough to let most bass frequencies through without getting muddy.
If you want a tweakable version you could wire up a capacitor blend pot (usually used at the input or output of a circuit) to blend between the stock 2u2 and a much larger cap or any 2 values you want. I’ve used this in several of my own builds and it is massively usable.
Leaving the amount of gain in the circuit alone also makes diode changes much more obvious. Put a big cap (or cap blend pot) in there and a 3 way diode toggle (or even a diode blend pot) and you’ve got a super flexible rat that still has all the amazing qualities of the best rats.

Also check out the comparative rat schematic demonstrating why the “vintage” rat circuit isn’t all that special (with the exception of the lm308). It’d take anyone who can solder 20 minutes or less to covert any rat to vintage specs. My rat 2 was already “vintage spec” other than the missing lm308.

Rats rule.
Use your head.
End rant.

This dude rules so much,

[PetZounds]

I found it!!

Awesome post!
Thank you for sharing that, very cool and informative.