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I can get some okay results using the dirty channel, cranking the master and using the gain as a volume. But, why does everything sound so harsh on the clean channel? I've never been able to figure it out. I can even plug a fuzz straight into the effects return and get a better tone. This is a known grievance with many modern Oranges, but what about their style of design causes this problem?

i read somewhere they have the same "high frequency" cap issue that vox ac15's have, for instance. bright cap that needs clipping.

no idea if its true, never looked at a schem. have you checked out the orange forum? lots of great info there.

I've been through the Orange birds before but couldn't find an answer. The general response to this topic is 'pedal x for me', or generally ignoring anything that could be seen as a criticism of the brand. I've been through some of the 'pedal X' suggestions and got okay tones, but there's no reason my LSTR for instance sounds so great on a variety of amps, but sounds harsh through the Rockerverb. If it something as simple as clipping a cap though, that'd be fantastic.

When I got my Beta Lead, the dude I bought it from was friends with the guy that invented the PAF Humbucker, Seth Lover (totally random to the story...he didn't tell me the name just said guy that made the PAF humbucker haha research). But the guy I got my Sunn from had just bought a new Marshall and it was harsh and trebly when they went into the studio (This was years ago...dude was in his 60s) and it was the first time really playing the amp (probably mail order buy). Seth lover went in and just cut out some caps and like 20 minutes later it was all back together and it sounded great and it got rid of all that harsh. Just thought it was a cool somewhat related story that might help you read up on other mods and apply them to the orange (not sure though and a good amp guy could probably figure it out).

I never tried the so called "bright cap mod" on my AC15C2, wich is also really picky with dirt pedals imo. I read it's totally worth it, though I have no idea whether that's ligit or the usual exaggerated internet bullshit.

I know you're not after just another pedal recommendation, but if your orange is anything like my vox in the way it handles distortion peds: I can comfirm that a Hotcake does indeed work nicely, even though it's nothing special with other amps imo. Especially at higher gain settings, it tends to sound muddy and dark.

I had this same problem with my Rockerverb. The clean channel hated dirt pedals. Always sounded wonky coz it was so bright. I had to run the dirty channel at the edge of breakup to get a clean tone that would be pedal friendly. Never even thought that it would be a bright cap. Coz I felt the issue lied in the clean channel's EQ. As you can't EQ that weirdness out.

Rotlung wrote:I can get some okay results using the dirty channel, cranking the master and using the gain as a volume. But, why does everything sound so harsh on the clean channel? I've never been able to figure it out. I can even plug a fuzz straight into the effects return and get a better tone. This is a known grievance with many modern Oranges, but what about their style of design causes this problem?

Huh, their orange crush cr120h is based on the rockerverb, could be why it hates my Silver Rose so much.

You could ask Dr. Dunwich Nick.

D.o.S. wrote:You could ask Dr. Dunwich Nick.

We can simplify and just start calling him Dr. Dunwich, it sounds awesome as fuck that way.

Indeed

maybe an EQ pedal in the effects loop could tame some of the harsh treble?

People (myself included) have this same problem a lot with Twins. I've found it helps to put a light drive/boost sort of pedal to get a little bit of gain before hitting the fuzz with your guitar signal. EQD Speaker Cranker, EP Booster and Lotus Snowjob have done the job well at different times. Might be worth trying with your Rockerverb.

I pulled up a schematic, 0.22uf (C24) on the input would be the first thing to go if this was mine, wire jumper style (after confirming a lack of DC on the grid of that tube).

I also notice they call for 0.001 (C30 AND 31) as a coupling caps. I don't know what star system the designer is from, but that would earn you endless scowls of derision in my neighbourhood. I'd go with 0.1 on those, and 0.22 and 0.47 on C23 & 32 respectively. Mind you, it's all hypothetical, but I would expect this to open up a huge can of worms elsewhere in the circuit regarding low frequency stability if it were on *my* bench, because that's how shit flows lately - but someone else might have better luck. Wiser people might just start increasing the caps gradually to taste (hint hint)

All in all, that circuit looks like a recipe for an icepick attack.

I'm in total agreement. Get those nasty small caps out of there. if I knew what i knew about amps now. I would have opened up my Rockerverb and done this. Instead of blaming the EQ. Worst case scenario I would have had to resell it at cost in as is condition which I did anyways, coz I got it at cost.

frigid midget wrote:I never tried the so called "bright cap mod" on my AC15C2, wich is also really picky with dirt pedals imo. I read it's totally worth it, though I have no idea whether that's ligit or the usual exaggerated internet bullshit.

+1 , that's my second vox (ac30cc2x and now ac15c1x) and I never had to claim about my sound. Maybe I'm deaf.