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I keep seeing these popping up on Kijiji, different guitar shops in the city, etc...

They are usually pretty cheap, though I can't see really anything wrong with them/any reason why they would be cheaper than any other twin.
Can someone enlighten me?
Is it just because they look 80s as fuck?
Is it worth buying one for my guitar rig?

1. They aren't the standard Blackface/Brownface/Tweed circuits, diminishing value to collectors and blues lawyers
2. They aren't the standard Blackface/etc cosmetics, diminishing value to turds mentioned above. Red knobs. Snake skin tolex. Rack mount heads.
3. Many of them have all sort of extra features not found on (m)any Fender amps of the time - FX loops, switchable power stages, multiple gain stages, pull/switchable EQ/bright/presence option, etc
4. On some, the gain channels are considered an acquired taste. I don't remember them being as bad as some people (again, blues lawyers) make them out to be, but it doesn't really matter since they all make great clean platforms.
5. They are heavy as fuck.
6. They are supposedly difficult to work on. Definitely more labor involved than a PTP circuit, but nothing a good tech shouldn't be able to handle.
7. People are stupid.

All that said, I've got nothin' but love for the one's I've owned or played extensively - the Twin and the Dual Showman. If I had the cash, the need, and/or the room, I wouldn't hesitate to pickup another, especially a Dual Showman or one of the Super 60 heads

Summed up: Fuck blues lawyers.

Yeah, I just have not had the chance to play around with one - but there are a couple pretty sweet looking ones for a really good price right now.
Thanks doommeow! I think I may pick one up

If there's one sitting in a guitar shop, go try it out or see if they'll let you rent it for a weekend. They are decent amps, not my holy grail but maybe someones. But if you're looking for a clean platform on the cheap they are always worth keeping in mind.

I have a black knob Princeton Chorus that's the same as the red knob except for cosmetics. Everything doommeow said is spot on. Not a fan of the dirt channel on mine (solid state and all) but the clean channel is pristine and the chorus and reverb are to die for. STEREO effects loop? Hell yes! I got mine for $100 on CL because one of the chrorus pots needed to be replaced but I regularly see other Fenders from the same family under $250.

Yeah I'm just starting to re-build a new guitar rig (I play bass), so I'm looking for a decent amp on the cheap. Mainly just need a really nice clean, as I plan to do the rest with my board. So from what yall are sayin', this might be something to consider. I'm gonna try and go play one this week!

TBQH, I was looking for a new amp last year, decided on a Fender and started my used search - I saw a used red knob on CL for absurdly cheap, emailed the guy with some questions, turns out I know him pretty well and he was like "look, I would feel like a dick selling you this amp at any price because it sucks which is why I'm flipping it".

You can get a reissue twin for not much more, or a Super Reverb for even cheaper. I haven't tried the red knob myself, and I'm no corksniffing blues lawyer who gives a shit about blackface vs. silverface, or the tonal differences between a 71 and a 73, but I'll wager they're always on sale for a reason. When I was researching the Super Reverb I wound up with I read nothing but "meh" to "they suck" reviews. The blues lawyers don't care for my 77 Super with master volume, but fuck them.... I don't SRV even when I'm drunk.....

I would suggest checking out Pauls or Cask Music - there's always a few cool deals there, and a few weirder finds. A guy I know from a semi popular band was showing me this insane Fender 70's knock off head he bought at Pauls for like $350 on a whim and it was killer.....

Or look into Traynors, I see there's always tons around stock or modded for reasonable prices and some of them seem awesome!!

Not that I'm telling you what to do - this is just my two cents.

retinal orbita wrote:TBQH, I was looking for a new amp last year, decided on a Fender and started my used search - I saw a used red knob on CL for absurdly cheap, emailed the guy with some questions, turns out I know him pretty well and he was like "look, I would feel like a dick selling you this amp at any price because it sucks which is why I'm flipping it".

You can get a reissue twin for not much more, or a Super Reverb for even cheaper. I haven't tried the red knob myself, and I'm no corksniffing blues lawyer who gives a shit about blackface vs. silverface, or the tonal differences between a 71 and a 73, but I'll wager they're always on sale for a reason. When I was researching the Super Reverb I wound up with I read nothing but "meh" to "they suck" reviews. The blues lawyers don't care for my 77 Super with master volume, but fuck them.... I don't SRV even when I'm drunk.....

I would suggest checking out Pauls or Cask Music - there's always a few cool deals there, and a few weirder finds. A guy I know from a semi popular band was showing me this insane Fender 70's knock off head he bought at Pauls for like $350 on a whim and it was killer.....

Or look into Traynors, I see there's always tons around stock or modded for reasonable prices and some of them seem awesome!!

Not that I'm telling you what to do - this is just my two cents.

Thanks for the tip man, I don't need anything too wild right now - but I do want something that I can get some time out of until I take playing guitar a little more seriously than playing bass. I too love Traynor gear, my bass rig is all Traynor...just trying to branch out!

I have been constantly browsing Paul's and Cask online until something I really dig comes along. Would totally rock that Emperor cab at Cask if they would let me finance it, being poor sucks.

The Red Knob Dual Showman is basically the same as the Fender Reissue Model T.

So there's that.

I always try to snag one on the super cheap but haven't done so successfully yet.

My brother had the Super 60. It was okay, but unremarkable. The cleans were pretty decent, the overdrive channel adequate. Didn't hold a candle to the silver face Bandmaster Reverb I had close in time to it in terms of the cleans or the reverb quality, but it was a good sounding, reasonable sized amp that he seemed to find handy enough to haul around. If you want a good Fender sound to use with pedals and some line level effects in the effects loop for pretty affordable prices, they can be a decent way to go.

The deal is they're awesome. So, we should stop talking about them.






























































(Loose lips makes things expensive)

wfs1234 wrote:(Loose lips makes things expensive)

When I saw this thread the first thing I thought of was the sleeper amps thread.

I don't have any experience with a tube red knob, but my Fender Eighty Five sounds really good to me, and the EQ section in the shitty dirt channel can make that channel sound not so shitty IMO.

The SS ones are better than the tube ones IMO.

They're a workable, sterile clean and get loud as hell and are a grand pedal platform. For the SS amps, if you can stomach it, the grey carpet monsters are quite decent generally (I'd avoid the pushbutton setting ones, but past that, drive on) and the 90s SS stuff that goes back to more traditional cosmetics but are essentially the same amps are where I'd be going. Want a Deluxe 85 without paying the markup? Deluxe 112/112+ etc on the clean channel sound exactly the same given variance from amp to amp.

The tube stuff is just missing something - I'm not a BF purist, but by the same token, when I want a Twin, I want a trem circuit and the classic reverb on tap, not push pull stuff that was put in its place. If it had both, sure.

Would I play one over, say a Crate? Yep.

But...I wouldn't seek one out much. They're undervalued but still at a premium versus what they'd be if they did not say the magic F word.

And ANY Fender tech should be able to work on it, this isn't 1990 - they've had longer than a lot of you folks have been alive to get the 'work on circuit board amps' thing down!

Super Rack is pretty great. I play one since one and a half year and dig it.