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I ordered a Pigtronix Philosophers Tone after hearing Mike Scheidt is a user and being intruiged with experimenting with fuzz/distortion and compression. Who uses compression here? Any tips for a 1st time user of the effect? How is the Philosophers Tone regarded?

Never used it on anything much past blues lawyer dirt - there's so much compression in high gain stuff that adding more is just...more flat.

Depends on what you mean by "heavy"

rfurtkamp wrote:Never used it on anything much past blues lawyer dirt - there's so much compression in high gain stuff that adding more is just...more flat.

This.
Hi-gain signal lacks valleys & peaks to compress...it's already sonic saturation right up to the threshold.
But you might be defining "heavy" as a dynamic, open-sounding fuzz tone with massive bottom end...and softened, not squashed peaks.

Philosopher's Tone isn't a super-squash compressor anyway...I think it's better for adding sustain and toneshaping applications....and you'll probably prefer the results from putting [it] after your favorite fuzz. Either way, trial & error is the only right path.

Yeah, it depends on the application and the instrument. The PT is great for sustain-y stuff, but it's certainly not what I'd call a "clean" compression. I use the 5-knob MXR bass compressor, and it's fantastic for my needs (as a hard compression/limiter, cuz I play bass and tend to hit pretty hard - it keeps me from clanking/clipping out, while still retaining dynamics and the sound of my instrument). Juan Alderete said some interesting stuff at an EQD demo session about how he uses an older Boss compressor because he knows that it emphasizes harmonics that push his fuzz into crazy areas.

As always with advice on ILF: you gotta give as many specifics about context and expectations as possible, and even then YMMV.

the Philo Tone is awesome for heavy! It's got some otherworldly amounts of compression on it but still sounds more natural than a dyna comp. With the blend and sustain turned up, there is so much volume. Like so so much. And the grit knob is cool to mix with other dirt, not really great on its own though. Boosting with compression, to me, seems a lot about making everything bigger and more, while boosting with volume feels more like boosting certain freqs over others (even though it boosts everything) making the dirt after respond better to some freqs than others rather than all the freqs. If that makes sense
Compression is fun with fuzz

I'm using the Philo King rather than the Philo Tone, but still, this.

zRobertez wrote:the Philo Tone is awesome for heavy! It's got some otherworldly amounts of compression on it but still sounds more natural than a dyna comp. With the blend and sustain turned up, there is so much volume. Like so so much. And the grit knob is cool to mix with other dirt, not really great on its own though. Boosting with compression, to me, seems a lot about making everything bigger and more, while boosting with volume feels more like boosting certain freqs over others (even though it boosts everything) making the dirt after respond better to some freqs than others rather than all the freqs. If that makes sense
Compression is fun with fuzz

Also, it's great for dare I say clean heaviness... Think modern Earth, or Trust-era LOW if Alan had a bigger amp... Clean, unclipped sustain; clean, unclipped feedback. That feeling of a couple of Twin's cranked to all get out, but without the walls starting to bleed.

I use a compressor up front when I can. I usually use a really light optical compression to bring out more harmonics and sustain more than anything else. Or, if I'm playing clean, I like the squish of a Dyna Comp and the near infiniteness of it. They run into heavy fuzz/distortion

Great information, as usual from ILF, thanks guys

skullservant wrote:I usually use a really light optical compression to bring out more harmonics and sustain more than anything else.

This. Can't stand squishy compression and all the noise that comes along with it.

I find my comp (Diamond Bass, EQ pot bypassed) adds some low mid beefiness and consistency in tone across my dirt pedals as well.

But yeh definitely place yer comp before dirt or else you'll get the castrating redundant compression people have been talking about earlier in the thread.

100% depends on what you mean by 'heavy'. I used to use a compressor on my bass the whole time, it really Shellac'd up my bass sound a lot. I've thought about using one for chuggy palm muted spinkick a meat eater in the face type guitar stuff recently. It's mad to really tighten up the bottom end and get that huge thunk on open string mosh parts.

Never really tried it with slower, doomier, get a big amp and carefully tailor your facial hair type guitar sounds...the sustain would be rad, wonder if it would clean up the low end too much?

dase wrote:100% depends on what you mean by 'heavy'. I used to use a compressor on my bass the whole time, it really Shellac'd up my bass sound a lot. I've thought about using one for chuggy palm muted spinkick a meat eater in the face type guitar stuff recently. It's mad to really tighten up the bottom end and get that huge thunk on open string mosh parts.

This just made me think I should try a compressor. Like I need more GAS.

Fuzz_Pi wrote:

skullservant wrote:I usually use a really light optical compression to bring out more harmonics and sustain more than anything else.

This. Can't stand squishy compression and all the noise that comes along with it.

I find my comp (Diamond Bass, EQ pot bypassed) adds some low mid beefiness and consistency in tone across my dirt pedals as well.

But yeh definitely place yer comp before dirt or else you'll get the castrating redundant compression people have been talking about earlier in the thread.

I disagree with the last sentence. Generally speaking, it's *better* to compress an overdriven signal than drive a compressed signal...
Compression raises noise floor, it's just nature of the beast...and increasing the noise before a gain stage is going to amplify [it] that much more.
But YMMV.
Like I said, trial & error is the only *right* way

doommeow wrote:I'm using the Philo King rather than the Philo Tone, but still, this.

zRobertez wrote:the Philo Tone is awesome for heavy! It's got some otherworldly amounts of compression on it but still sounds more natural than a dyna comp. With the blend and sustain turned up, there is so much volume. Like so so much. And the grit knob is cool to mix with other dirt, not really great on its own though. Boosting with compression, to me, seems a lot about making everything bigger and more, while boosting with volume feels more like boosting certain freqs over others (even though it boosts everything) making the dirt after respond better to some freqs than others rather than all the freqs. If that makes sense
Compression is fun with fuzz

Also, it's great for dare I say clean heaviness... Think modern Earth, or Trust-era LOW if Alan had a bigger amp... Clean, unclipped sustain; clean, unclipped feedback. That feeling of a couple of Twin's cranked to all get out, but without the walls starting to bleed.

this sounds fucking awesome
one of my first pedals was a joyo compressor, was pretty cool but i got bored of it quick
been thinking about getting an accountant but now im thinking maybe philo tone

I really like using my instant lofi junky with other dirt pedals. it's very heavy and compressed. but the lofi junky isn't really your normal compress, you don't have any real control over it. but anyway it sounds great and is very musical. it also boosts lows and cuts highs so it can calm down crazier shrill stuff which I really like.
compression for heavy, no doubt