Louder tube cleans?

[HeavyXIII]

So, I'm in a position to compare several amp types and pedal fixes for this, so come at me with your wildest suggestions!

I've always been a dynamics player when it comes to clean tones. I've been playing in some jam band type scenarios and I notice that when there is a second guitarist, I tend to disappear in the mix when I use my volume pedal for that "rolled off" clean sound. With the addition of a clean boost/fuzz to my pedalboard, I find myself turning my preamp down and my master volume up. (read lots of articles about power tube compression and dynamic response BS) In addition to turning up the master volume even more and getting an even cleaner "base" tone, is there anything I should try to retain punch in a live mix when I roll off for dem cleans? I tried a few compressors around the board and in the FX loop, but they seemed to kill my sound, not enhance it.

Wut sez yu? Hive mind of teh fuzz werld?

[D.o.S.]

I, uh, don't know what you mean by "rolled off." You mean like no tone knob?

I'd also really like to know what you're using for a setup -- and this is a guitar, right, not a bass?

[backwardsvoyager]

^ i think he means using a volume pedal to pull back what's going into the amp for a cleaner sound.

i'm kind of confused though, if you're a 'dynamics player doesn't that mean you get a cleaner tone by altering playing dynamics instead of rolling down the volume with a pedal or knob? i've never liked using volume pedals for anything but swells, i think they're what 'kills' tone personally, if it rolls off the high end you're not gonna cut through live because higher frequencies don't travel as far as lower frequencies and it's gonna sound muddy.
i would recommend the smallsound/bigsound Sparkle Motion, which can get the cutting tone you would associate with a treble booster but it's really tweakable so you can dial out harshness and get a nice chimey clean tone.

[HeavyXIII]

Yup, guitar, no bass...yet. I'm running a 2 humbucker guitar with fairly bright pickups into 2 AORs, one of the 50W variety, the other around 100W.

^ i think he means using a volume pedal to pull back what's going into the amp for a cleaner sound.

i'm kind of confused though, if you're a 'dynamics player doesn't that mean you get a cleaner tone by altering playing dynamics instead of rolling down the volume with a pedal or knob? i've never liked using volume pedals for anything but swells, i think they're what 'kills' tone personally, if it rolls off the high end you're not gonna cut through live because higher frequencies don't travel as far as lower frequencies and it's gonna sound muddy.
i would recommend the smallsound/bigsound Sparkle Motion, which can get the cutting tone you would associate with a treble booster but it's really tweakable so you can dial out harshness and get a nice chimey clean tone.

Now THAT is something I could try, as I already own a treble booster. And I suppose being a dynamics player isn't quite accurate, as I don't get the majority of my cleans via picking dynamics. As far as the volume pedal goes, I haven't noticed any loss of high end, but I have been using it for quite some time now so I'll probably also try running my rig NMV style and pumping the treble booster for more up front boost/dirt next time I can get to all my stuff. For the record, the compressor I used *worked* just kind of opposite. My distortion sound got dramatically quieter, such that my cleans were louder, proportionally speaking.

[The4455]

You could try an ExoticK EP booster. It's a pre-amp pedal based on a certain tape delay's pre-amp stage.

[Hyphen Nation]

I am a huge fan of the sparkle. So tunable. I recently discovered I love using the clean on my TAFM as a boost.
Super shimmer, able to season in dirt to tasee.
Just use the clean volume as your primary effect to start with.

-D

[rfurtkamp]

Sounds like perhaps your volume pedal and the rest of your rig don't like each other - try a different impedance one/brand/type/position in the chain and see if that fixes it.

The latter is free, just takes some time to test.

[UglyCasanova]

i've never liked using volume pedals for anything but swells, i think they're what 'kills' tone personally

Depends on your volume pedal. I recommend the Mission Engineering VM-pro. It has a "sparkle switch" which restores brightness/treble when rolling back volume. It also has switches for active/passive PUs and selectable output impedance for use with vintage fuzz pedals (tricking them into thinking they are the first pedal in the chain), a kick ass buffer, and an isolated secondary tuner out. It's a $200 dollar volume pedal, but if you really want one with great features that doesn't tone-suck, it's the one.

[OddKnowledge]

turn the mids and highs on your amp up to "too much" and then roll off using the guitar?

[friendship]

I forget what the technique is called or how you do it, but I'm told there's a pretty simple way to modify your volume knob so that when you roll it back, the treble stays the same (or boosts? I don't remember). Sounds like it could be what you're looking for.

[GAS KING]

treble bleed
http://vintagevibeguitars.com/dox/trebleBleed_tip.pdf

[friendship]

yeah that's the ticket

[HeavyXIII]

Ya, it's not so much an issue of "too dark" or "muddy", it just isn't quite the same in terms of volume. And maybe they just can't be the same (or more the same, whatever), the way I get cleans. But I figured if anyone had the solution, it'd be here.

Will definitely look into different impedance volume pedals and positioning and such. My bassist may have picked up a different version from mine.

[Tristan]

If you have an amp with an fx loop you could also try a boost in there, switch it on when you want cleans that match the volume of your drivesound and match to taste.
Also, The Elements and maybe also The Cleanness has an exp input for volume adjustments so if you put that one in your fx loop with an expression pedal you basically have a super hitech buffered volume pedal and more.
TheGigRig switching systems have a pre and post boost built in for each fx loop so you can basically always match your clean and drive sounds the way you want them.
I'm just wondering though, do you use a drive pedal to get your dirty sounds or is it mostly coming out of the amp?

[Casavettes]

Kinda just sounds like you need an EQ pedal