ilovefuzz.com

Those guys are un-frickin'-believable..
:end of semi-rant:

Thank god I found ILF

Yes, they are.

Welcome home.

always find it funny seeing those ppl STILL splitting hair over which klons and (even derived to the) klones sound the best, at least to my cheap ears they sounded the same for that kind of money. They need the dirtiest fuzz pedal for cleansing their brain

Id take a $75 drive off any of the shark tankers over those ridiculous prices for those klons.

What shits me about TGP (apart from EVERYTHING):
1) Any pedal made to the same specs is going to sound the same. The fact that one doesn't sound exactly the same as the other with all the pots at 12 has more to do with normal part tolerances, the same differences would be found in a regular production pedal (except if you're Boss and can control production processes more)
2) That you can hear a difference between handwired and PCB versions of the same pedal. See point 1
3) When there is one of the biannual shitstorms that occur when someone from freestompboxes discovers a hyped pedal is in fact a part for part clone of another pedal people, apart from saying points one and two) someone with "mad technical skillz" unscrews the back cover, takes a photo of the pcb and says "look, it doesn't look anything like pedal x, it's obviously not a clone".
So much fucking misinformation.

I'm really glad I ended up here - nice dudes, with a real love for interesting sounds and builders, and dudes who aren't afraid to say "I'm buying this pedal because the colours are rad and it is going to go well with my purple themed pedal board" instead of trying to invent some bogus shit about needing said purple pedal because it can better deliver "real tone".

Oh yeah - no praise and worship threads at ILF = win. Hasn't anyone read about the separation of Church, state and fuzz?

greigoroth wrote:What shits me about TGP (apart from EVERYTHING):
1) Any pedal made to the same specs is going to sound the same. The fact that one doesn't sound exactly the same as the other with all the pots at 12 has more to do with normal part tolerances, the same differences would be found in a regular production pedal (except if you're Boss and can control production processes more)
2) That you can hear a difference between handwired and PCB versions of the same pedal. See point 1
3) When there is one of the biannual shitstorms that occur when someone from freestompboxes discovers a hyped pedal is in fact a part for part clone of another pedal people, apart from saying points one and two) someone with "mad technical skillz" unscrews the back cover, takes a photo of the pcb and says "look, it doesn't look anything like pedal x, it's obviously not a clone".
So much fucking misinformation.

I'm really glad I ended up here - nice dudes, with a real love for interesting sounds and builders, and dudes who aren't afraid to say "I'm buying this pedal because the colours are rad and it is going to go well with my purple themed pedal board" instead of trying to invent some bogus shit about needing said purple pedal because it can better deliver "real tone".

Oh yeah - no praise and worship threads at ILF = win. Hasn't anyone read about the separation of Church, state and fuzz?

I agree with this 100% and wish I can add something but you hit it right on the head. I just love this place.

Beside the TGP shit, a short thought about hearing (differences):
Anybody who likes to eat hot has had the discussion about the hot food, "Dude, that only tastes hot, all other things are no more tasteable cause my mouth is BURNING!" and you answer "If you get used to it you will taste a lot more, the normal meal and on top the taste of the chilli/sauce/etc.".
It is a bit like that with hearing differences or subtle things. Some people are used to hear distinct differences and some just hear "better" than others. Don't judge them because YOU don't hear a difference. They might hear it and feel uncomfortable with special things that are not comprehensible for you. Grant it to them.
And BTW you are lucky when you are not hearing that good: saves a lot of money and time.

But i agree, on TGP you have more people with money that discuss about stuff on odd levels. Nobody needs to comprehend that - just respect it

Dude don't get me wrong, I'm down with people being able to hear different things, and different things are important to different people - that's not what gets me wound up. I'm talking about for example the Joyo Ultimate Drive and the Freekish blues. Physics is physics. If a circuit is the same, with the same components and the same tolerances, it is going to sound the same. Any eventual differences are due to small variations caused by part tolerances, and on a boutique builder scale, those part tolerances are going to cause differences even in the same batch of pedals from the same manufacturer. That is, the variations that may make a clone appear "different" are also present in the original pedal.

I'm fine with people discussing Russian muff vs Civil war muff for example, because there are small, meaningful differences in the circuits. I'm fine with people thinking one civil war muff is better than another, as EHX was infamous for having a somewhat "liberal" approach to choosing parts when building their pedals. There are, in other words, physical differences between the pedals. Some people may notice it, some won't, but the differences are there. (How relevant those differences are for a bunch of hacks playing in their bedrooms is a question for another day, and in that issue I really don't care - you want it and are prepared to pay for it then fine, have fun). But when stuff IS the same I get agitated. Or stuff like people hearing one type of solder or another, or directional cables. You can't bend the laws of physics, regardless of how much you've paid for your blues od.

In general we're free from that sort of bullshit here, which I love. We're relatively free from hype as well - people get excited about gear all the time (which I LOVE!), but people are also prepared to post demos and be a little critical of stuff. I like that combination of intelligent discussion, creativity and enthusiasm that you get here. I haven't logged in to TGP for ages, pretty much not since I joined ILF, but that sort of critical approach to GAS just doesn't exist at TGP. There it feels more like a mob rules sort of situation, where people egg each other on into thinking something is the best thing ever, regardless of the results or the actual product.

I post on TGP and here, my post count is higher here though.

There is a lot of technical and practical information over there if you weed through the fields and fields of bullshit. You have to remember, TGP has over 100,000 registered users. It's basically like walking into a city and looking for the cool things you know should be there, but first you have to navigate past a bunch of slack-jawed gawkers, street corner preachers, crazy people, businessmen, idiots, etc.

Oh yeah I too still read and browse around in tgp (on my researches mostly via google), so many great infos there, I just need to get in and get out.. not to linger.

I tell you, they are unicorns with their unicorn ears, horse whine and will burn you down.. they can sense sharply on the almost non existence differences in pedals even in a live band situation with ignorance 2nd guitarist and his cheaper taste rigs, rumbling bass, mad skill rolling thunder drummer, gap covering keyboards and distracting vocals.

And their p&w people are the worst with their ''humble'' setup & braggery.. the most elite of all (don't get me wrong, i used to play for church myself). I don't mind you with your money to buy neat things, heck I might do the same if I'm rich.. I just can't stand their 'stare-down', irrational thoughts and preach of influences

So god help us in ilf, don't lead us into the same elitist-blackhole

i get the feeling that theres some kind of common knowledge at tgp
that your supposed to know if you wanna ask a question
so much "view topic" bullshit
ive never seen a question on here go unanswered
let alone told it was a lame question or
"use the search button"
i think i asked one question at tgp
and i bet you can guess that they loved
my pathetic typing skillz over there and
my complete lack of gear experience
just not a welcoming atmosphere
i freakin<3 i<3fuzz,and <3yous guys

greigoroth wrote:Dude don't get me wrong, I'm down with people being able to hear different things, and different things are important to different people - that's not what gets me wound up. I'm talking about for example the Joyo Ultimate Drive and the Freekish blues. Physics is physics. If a circuit is the same, with the same components and the same tolerances, it is going to sound the same. Any eventual differences are due to small variations caused by part tolerances, and on a boutique builder scale, those part tolerances are going to cause differences even in the same batch of pedals from the same manufacturer. That is, the variations that may make a clone appear "different" are also present in the original pedal.

I'm fine with people discussing Russian muff vs Civil war muff for example, because there are small, meaningful differences in the circuits. I'm fine with people thinking one civil war muff is better than another, as EHX was infamous for having a somewhat "liberal" approach to choosing parts when building their pedals. There are, in other words, physical differences between the pedals. Some people may notice it, some won't, but the differences are there. (How relevant those differences are for a bunch of hacks playing in their bedrooms is a question for another day, and in that issue I really don't care - you want it and are prepared to pay for it then fine, have fun). But when stuff IS the same I get agitated. Or stuff like people hearing one type of solder or another, or directional cables. You can't bend the laws of physics, regardless of how much you've paid for your blues od.

What you speak is the truth, but, also, you have to take into account that most of the people on TGP are idiots. That factors majorly into the equation.

@greigoroth: i didn't get you wrong. Everything Fine. I tend to have almost the same opinion.
I think it is just important, so i mentioned it, that there are hearing differences. Everybody should be aware of that. So my Example that it is as normal as taste.

devideva wrote: Anyway, I am not trouble.

You keep saying that.