ilovefuzz.com

Well Ancient Astronaught is working on a full length album we plan on recording around february or march. I'm in the process of writing lyrics based around a central theme for the entire album, the album is to be continuous with no actual silence between tracks, and it is going to basically tell a generalized story that is relevent to pretty much everyone, basically the hard lessons in life that made you who are you. All the lyrics come from our collective experiences mirrored to the creation of man as a species as speculated by ancient alien theorists from the study of sumerian and other ancient texts. I grew up listening to alot of positive hardcore bands mixed with very emotionally driven bands and i like to reflect that in what my lyrics say as i feel those bands and their positive message is a message worth spreading to those willing to listen. My question is how many of you actually listen to the lyrics, and or really look at what their saying or truly mean at the core behind the veil of the words chosen? How many of you really don't care about what their saying and only care about the music behind it? and how many of you consider everything as a whole and take into context the lyrics with the music behind them? also if any of you have tips for getting thoughts onto paper and eventually into music i'm all ears! I've spent so many years behind the drum kit that writing riffs and lyrics and doing vocals is pretty new to me (although i've been playing guitar for almost 15 years) so any suggestion is welcome. now....

I usually consider the instrumental first. If I like the instrumental then I pay attention to the vocals and lyrics.

I was a little confused by your post, so I'm just going to leave some lyric writing tips and hope it helps you .

Try not to go into it with too much focus on a subject. Meanings can be drawn up from nearly anything you say, so always leave yourself plenty of room. If you have a goal in mind, just put some words together that you think sound nice and bend them to your meaning. It may sound a little cheap, but you'll get some interesting results. Always strive for the lyrics to be interesting. Nobody is going to listen to what you have to say if it's not interesting. Get familiar with your language. While the deepest things come from the heart, extending your vocabulary can really spice it up. Don't feel like you need things to rhyme, or have any sort of structure really. This depends on your genre of course, but don't let things like that confine you.

Also, if your music is good enough, none of that is very important, so always make sure your happy with the music before diving into writing lyrics.

Hope I helped some!

charles wrote:I was a little confused by your post, so I'm just going to leave some lyric writing tips and hope it helps you .

Try not to go into it with too much focus on a subject. Meanings can be drawn up from nearly anything you say, so always leave yourself plenty of room. If you have a goal in mind, just put some words together that you think sound nice and bend them to your meaning. It may sound a little cheap, but you'll get some interesting results. Always strive for the lyrics to be interesting. Nobody is going to listen to what you have to say if it's not interesting. Get familiar with your language. While the deepest things come from the heart, extending your vocabulary can really spice it up. Don't feel like you need things to rhyme, or have any sort of structure really. This depends on your genre of course, but don't let things like that confine you.

Also, if your music is good enough, none of that is very important, so always make sure your happy with the music before diving into writing lyrics.

Hope I helped some!

Thanks neighbor! (im in va too) That makes alot of sense and i appreciate the input!

I listen to the lyrics. I don't (very rarely at least) sit down and do a structured analysis, but I pay attention to references to things outside the text (like a philosophical concept) and inside it (like an allusion to a metaphor in another song on the album), the album's general message, a proposed set of terms (tools for interpreting life and acting in the world), any "morals of the story".

On the other hand, I hate obscurantism/vagueness but with the "illusion of meaning". As in people sitting down trying really hard to decrypt Jim Morrisson's less coherent lyrics. If the person who wrote it is trying to get a message across, he should just say it. Not that the poetic aspect isn't important. It's just, don't expect me to keep paying attention if you don't give me anything to latch onto.

Every piece has a purpose. There's a reason (or at least a cause) the person went and recorded or performed it. I dislike some reasons and like some: I dislike when the primary purpose of the piece is to put yourself above others (the vagueness enters here too; you're not worthy of understanding unless you see through my "code" - often the message is weak and could've just been explicitly stated in a few sentences).

Others are nicer; communication or establishing contact with those like you, even if it's without the hope of literal two-way communication. Also, monumentalization - text as a means of creation outside text. Ancient Egyptians would make pictures of the god of storm/chaos (Sethos) small in relation to other reliefs in a temple to not give tthe picture too much power. Also indirectly related to the "tools of life" thing. The actual incarnation of the text as mediating artefact. Also, creating new meanings out of familiar situations.

They all kinda sorta almost run together. Just my mind scattered on the ground, sorry.

As for the actual writing If you have an idea outline your story/message, let it "grow" around riffs or phrases that pop into your head. Rework, restructure, start over etc until it's acceptable to you. Not that far along? Ask yourself what your feelings are about your life. Ask yourself for the causes of the general feeling of wrongness, for example. Capitalism? Animal nature bad fit with modern life? Complain/observe state of affairs and/or create new perspectives and analogies for changing the world/your mind. No one understands you? Put your mind on paper one aspect or thought at a time and show them.

I apologize if this just comes off as an incoherent mess

Birthday Boy wrote:I apologize if this just comes off as an incoherent mess

HAHA it's all good i'm sure if you read my OP you can see i write as an incoherent mess as well! In reality it made complete sense and i appreciate you taking the time to type that out it gave me alot of insight on an outside point of view. I agree with the dislike of vague lyrics, i try and not right that way, i appreciate straight forward tell it like it is lyrics, i.e. Biohazard... You mention the poetic side of lyric writing and expanding my vocabulary, well that's why i try to tie in the sumerian beliefs into my writing, i take a generalized thought and relate it to what they called it giving me a reference point that if anyone was really inclined could easily find the meaning or really figure it out themselves, i don't write anything that would requier college level research just to figure out. One thing i need to work on is writing riffs and lyrics together, sometimes i find a killer riff i wanna do vocals over but find myself lost on what to do for the rest of the song and while we are trying to combine instrumental and parts with vocals as a band we agree that there needs to be more parts specifically written for vocals. Your post has given some idea's on how to approach this and i appreciate that immensely! Thanks!

Ancient Astronaught wrote:

Birthday Boy wrote:I apologize if this just comes off as an incoherent mess

HAHA it's all good i'm sure if you read my OP you can see i write as an incoherent mess as well! In reality it made complete sense and i appreciate you taking the time to type that out it gave me alot of insight on an outside point of view. I agree with the dislike of vague lyrics, i try and not right that way, i appreciate straight forward tell it like it is lyrics, i.e. Biohazard... You mention the poetic side of lyric writing and expanding my vocabulary, well that's why i try to tie in the sumerian beliefs into my writing, i take a generalized thought and relate it to what they called it giving me a reference point that if anyone was really inclined could easily find the meaning or really figure it out themselves, i don't write anything that would requier college level research just to figure out. One thing i need to work on is writing riffs and lyrics together, sometimes i find a killer riff i wanna do vocals over but find myself lost on what to do for the rest of the song and while we are trying to combine instrumental and parts with vocals as a band we agree that there needs to be more parts specifically written for vocals. Your post has given some idea's on how to approach this and i appreciate that immensely! Thanks!

When I do write lyrics, I like to think of the aesthetic of the sentence, and sometimes try to approach saying something simple in a roundabout way that appears pleasing to me. Sometimes a phrase will pop into my head and sometimes I'll chisel away for weeks to try and find a couplet. There's no hard and fast rule, really.

I don't like to be direct, but like to use general metaphors to describe basic situations. I'm not one for writing my lyrics anywhere, they are quite personal,if somewhat oblique on occasion. But generally I'll work pretty hard to make sure what i'm saying is somewhat suggestive of the mood in my head.

Our track, 'Tempest', was named that a year before I wrote lyrics to it, it brought to mind storms and seas, so I worked on having the words reflect that. The words to 'Leadfoot' on the other hand were just a short two verse poem I wrote called 'Advaita' that seemed to want to be in patches throughout an (originally) 15 minute dirge. I always let the music dictate what it wants. I'm always scribbling things down, patching them together. Out of my graphomania, sometimes thoughts and songs rear their ugly, expectant heads.

The above is meant as genuine advice from my own reflections, not as any kind of "I'm awesome I write shit all the time" bullshit.

I feel that i'm generally on the same page as you my friend! I usually find myself coming up with a few sentances that match well together and then just writing what ever comes to mind sometimes i even find that lyrics i wrote to one song work better in others and sometimes i will set out and write a huge epic song and then chop it up. You said that you listen to the music and then write lyrics that match the feeling, with our album i actually have the goal and general idea for each song written out so i'm taking the opposite approach and writing the lyrics to fit the album concept i have in my head and then come's the complicated but sometimes fun part of writing music that fits idea of the lyrics or if i don't have lyrics the concept necessary to achieve the end result for the album, which means lots of jamming a rough recordings then going back and seeing what we feel fits where which actually can be a really productive engine if done correctly and efficiently. I'm lucky to have a an extremely talented lyricist for a drummer in our band but as much as i really look up to his talent i feel he can sometimes get too poetic and intelligent for our music, but luckily he is also very versed in ancient sumerian beliefs, so what we've been doing since we tend to do dual vocals on a more constant basis is i write the forefront vocals and basis of the song and he adds his own lyrics that complement mine, which i think is really cool because i look up to his abilities as a vocalist and for him to want to complement mine and not overtake them shows that he has confidence in me and my abilities. I thank you very much for your advice and it has def been taken into consideration, and it def did not come off as ""I'm awesome I write shit all the time" bullshit."

Ancient Astronaught wrote:I feel that i'm generally on the same page as you my friend! I usually find myself coming up with a few sentances that match well together and then just writing what ever comes to mind sometimes i even find that lyrics i wrote to one song work better in others and sometimes i will set out and write a huge epic song and then chop it up. You said that you listen to the music and then write lyrics that match the feeling, with our album i actually have the goal and general idea for each song written out so i'm taking the opposite approach and writing the lyrics to fit the album concept i have in my head and then come's the complicated but sometimes fun part of writing music that fits idea of the lyrics or if i don't have lyrics the concept necessary to achieve the end result for the album, which means lots of jamming a rough recordings then going back and seeing what we feel fits where which actually can be a really productive engine if done correctly and efficiently. I'm lucky to have a an extremely talented lyricist for a drummer in our band but as much as i really look up to his talent i feel he can sometimes get too poetic and intelligent for our music, but luckily he is also very versed in ancient sumerian beliefs, so what we've been doing since we tend to do dual vocals on a more constant basis is i write the forefront vocals and basis of the song and he adds his own lyrics that complement mine, which i think is really cool because i look up to his abilities as a vocalist and for him to want to complement mine and not overtake them shows that he has confidence in me and my abilities. I thank you very much for your advice and it has def been taken into consideration, and it def did not come off as ""I'm awesome I write shit all the time" bullshit."

Excellent.

I love all that Sumerian mythology. Ah. I get your band name now. Like an idiot it took me a while...



I wrote an album a few years ago in a similar fashion, an overarching story and concept and whatnot. It's possible. Best thing is to go with your gut dude!It's all a puzzle you can put together in any fashion you wish. I'm still pretty proud of the work, if not the recording. Listening to the five Ancient Astronaught tracks I downloaded from reverbnation. Checked it out a while back and going back to it now. Give me a heads up when you have new material out. I dig it man. Truly. Some awesome music on this forum.

It's cool to have people in the band pushing you like that. Very encouraging and helps you to get good real fast. Like Suzuki method for grownups!

haha it take's some people some time, what's funny is i use it as a pseudonym for "an old head" which ties back into the duality of the lyrics....

We are looking at getting the album out around next may hopefully, we will be tracking drums and bass in february and march and i will be tracking guitars and vocals in april once my Dunwich head comes in thanks for the complements on the music my friend, that album was written and recorded within 6 months of being an official band, now we have alot more experience, are playing tighter, have a completely different and heavier tone, and have done alot of upgrading to our music and studio equipment so the full length will hopefully represent the maturing and evolution of the band to the best of our abilities. This time it will get full blown mastering (still deciding on who i want to do it we usually use Bill Wolf, a grammy award winning mastering tech that is phenominal, but i would be really interested in a few other people's interpretations who may be more familiar with the genre) and will be released in a true digipac not just our DIY method of before, i will def keep you updated!

I agree it's nice having supporting members that are pushing me to do more vocals and write more guitar solos... it's funny everyone likes more guitar solo's but nobody likes more drum solo's so the role reversal for me is intriguing.

If the chorus or a specific well emphasized line relates to me and my experience/knowledge in some way I usually pay attention to the lyrics a lot more. Once I started playing guitar and further learning bass, playing drums, synths etc. lyrics kind of got thrown down the priorities list. But if the artist is energetic enough or has something to say I usually pay attention.

I feel if there's an important line of the song, that's the time to have a dynamic change and tell the rest of the instruments to chill out or work around the lyrics. Then later on you can say it more energetically/musically since people heard what you said before. If you want lyrics or a certain phrase to be emphasized make people hear it. It's like one of my photo professors said, if you want people to see a certain interaction or colors/forms, make them see it. It's difficult to get people to listen to lyrics on the first listen but if you compose/frame it right you can make it easier for them. Maybe on the 2nd, 10th, or 100th listen they'll pick it up.

PumpkinPieces wrote:If you want lyrics or a certain phrase to be emphasized make people hear it. It's like one of my photo professors said, if you want people to see a certain interaction or colors/forms, make them see it. It's difficult to get people to listen to lyrics on the first listen but if you compose/frame it right you can make it easier for them. Maybe on the 2nd, 10th, or 100th listen they'll pick it up.

That's really good advice. I can definitely see how to tie that in and in some ways how im all ready doing that so this is great advice! Thanks so much!

I'm happy that it made some sense. I have problems drawing the line between my mind and the external world/other people sometimes.

By the way, Adoom, me and my guitarist were just listening to Somnia. I've said it before in your thread but it's amazing. My guitaristt thought so too.

Birthday Boy, thank you. I'm glad you dig it. You're too kind. Hopefully someday we may share a stage together.

Ancient Astronaught wrote:

PumpkinPieces wrote:If you want lyrics or a certain phrase to be emphasized make people hear it. It's like one of my photo professors said, if you want people to see a certain interaction or colors/forms, make them see it. It's difficult to get people to listen to lyrics on the first listen but if you compose/frame it right you can make it easier for them. Maybe on the 2nd, 10th, or 100th listen they'll pick it up.

That's really good advice. I can definitely see how to tie that in and in some ways how im all ready doing that so this is great advice! Thanks so much!

That is excellent advice. Excellent. Well done Pumpkinpieces.

Ancient Astronaught wrote:haha it take's some people some time, what's funny is i use it as a pseudonym for "an old head" which ties back into the duality of the lyrics....

We are looking at getting the album out around next may hopefully, we will be tracking drums and bass in february and march and i will be tracking guitars and vocals in april once my Dunwich head comes in thanks for the complements on the music my friend, that album was written and recorded within 6 months of being an official band, now we have alot more experience, are playing tighter, have a completely different and heavier tone, and have done alot of upgrading to our music and studio equipment so the full length will hopefully represent the maturing and evolution of the band to the best of our abilities. This time it will get full blown mastering (still deciding on who i want to do it we usually use Bill Wolf, a grammy award winning mastering tech that is phenominal, but i would be really interested in a few other people's interpretations who may be more familiar with the genre) and will be released in a true digipac not just our DIY method of before, i will def keep you updated!

I agree it's nice having supporting members that are pushing me to do more vocals and write more guitar solos... it's funny everyone likes more guitar solo's but nobody likes more drum solo's so the role reversal for me is intriguing.

Notatallman, thanks for the tunes. I'm truly looking forward to it, and I'm sure it'll be epic. If you need some strings on the record, let me know.

Drum solos can be awesome, Phil Collins represent! I jest. (Though 'Duchess' still has one of the best vocal performances ever committed to tape. Ever.)