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never played one. what are some good examples of recordings that have this sound? what is the sound? what are some good relatively budget friendly pedals based on the fuzz face?

They are alright. Jimi used them . Never really gave them much attention, haha. Post fail.

In a modern context? Tame Impala use them in combo with overdrives for a mad fuzzed out sound

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NNHiWFvfV8[/youtube]

If you just want to hear a fuzz face, put on Hendrix's Band of Gypsies, it's all over it.

You can build one for cheap, if you just want to hear the circuit and don't mind not having an enclosure, true-bypass switch, etc.
I'd recommend the Multiface on perfboard and a number of transistors/FETs + caps to try in it: http://www.home-wrecker.com/multiface.html
Then you can hear it for yourself.

Otherwise, I'd say that germanium fuzzfaces are a really smooth fuzz, but some of them can get more gain-y and heavy, depending on the tweaks and transistors used.

Silicon transistor fuzzfaces can be everything from mild fuzz/distortion to that thrash sound, depending on gain setting, transistors used, etc. A lot of silicon fuzz faces sound fizzy to my ears. That said, I built and enjoy playing my own silicon fuzz face with simple/common 2n3904 transistors. As noted by Heavy_Soul, they sound great with an overdrive in front of them (IMHO).

History lessons:
http://fuzzcentral.ssguitar.com/fuzzface.php
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuzz_Face

Tech explanation that is a really good read:
http://geofex.com/Article_Folders/fuzzface/fftech.htm

I link all that because it's important to recognize that the fuzz face is a really simple circuit: While you can pay a lot of money for vintage NoS components and germanium transistors, essentially everyone selling a fuzzface is selling some variation on this very simple circuit. With guitar pedal circuits, though, tiny changes to values can change a lot of the tone, and components can sound different from one to the other even if they're the same value.

Because of the variance of germanium transistors, one vintage Fuzzface would sound different compared to another.. famous guitarists in the past had the luxury of sorting through piles to find a couple with the sweet sound they were after. Nowadays a lot more people use fuzz and those vintage units are a lot rarer, so you don't have that luxury. So the sound you hear on older records from Hendrix, Townsend, Gilmour (before he got a Big Muff, AFAIK), may not be the same one you get with a modern germanium fuzz. The silicon fuzz faces are a lot more stable, but don't have quite the same sound.

A lot of more conventional blues-rock folks like to back off their volume knob into a FF to use it more like an overdrive. Some folks think GE clean up better. I certainly don't think that a good SI FF cleans up poorly. Lower gain SI transistors tend to work better for non-extreme, non-splatty stuff and better clean-up.

Be careful about Dunlop Fuzz Faces and their derived circuits -- a lot of them have buffer circuits that may or may not serve what you want to do. Do your research on the given model.

For a good, cheap FF, I like the Seymour Duncan Tweak Fuzz, especially having gotten mine for about $60 new. It's a SI FF with a switchable input tone control and, problematically for some, not huge output in stock form. The volume fix is a well know mod and most standard FF mods will work great on it. The tone switching is pretty dang useful.

You can probably get someone to build you a silicon fuzzface for the price of a new mass-production pedal. Or build one yourself for less than buying one used.

Gearmanndude to the rescue, as usual, for what a Fuzz face sounds like:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UchIXsX3OkY[/youtube]
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZ5_n2vH8mw[/youtube]
I'm not a huge fan of the Dunlop Fuzz Face reissues, to be honest.

Fulltone made some great fuzz faces, IMHO, but they cost way too much:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ACfvIwlTWOk[/youtube]
(Fav part in this video is probably showing the sustain of the note between the two at around 1:30 in.)
Luckily, it's possible to build to Fulltone '69-specs or '70-specs with the general guitar gadgets kits.

Pink Floyd-echoes..........................................................................………...............

Heavy_Soul wrote:In a modern context? Tame Impala use them in combo with overdrives for a mad fuzzed out sound

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NNHiWFvfV8[/youtube]

It's cool to watch your avatar while the music is playing.

adrianlee wrote:Pink Floyd-echoes..........................................................................………...............

F'realz. Watch Pink Floyd: Live at Pompeii. Not only isn't the greatest concert film ever made, it's also chock full of Gilmour juicing every last orgasm-inducing note out of a dallas-arbiter fuzz and an old Binson Ecorec tape echo

I have one of those MXR BC108 fuzz's. I like it. It gets a good velcro-ey fuzz and a smoother more textural fuzz with the buffer on.

a lot of good information in this thread. I just comment on Silicon vs germanium... the silicon has a fine line between clipping and no clipping. the germanium tends to have a smother transition into the dirt/fuzz. likewise, the silicon is gonna be more compressed and its no gonna let any dynamics through when you have both knobs cranked. so as for volume knob and picking volume to get different amounts of fuzz, the germanium will give you more subtle shades of variation. germanium is more susceptible to temperature changing the sound. also germanium can dry up and drift over the years. its more of a problem when buying a 40 year old pedal than if your building it new with NOS germanium. when building new, you can reject all the bad transistors and bias everything to work with the transistors you have. it will be a better product than your average vintage fuzz.

mathias wrote:You can probably get someone to build you a silicon fuzzface for the price of a new mass-production pedal. Or build one yourself for less than buying one used.

Gearmanndude to the rescue, as usual, for what a Fuzz face sounds like:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UchIXsX3OkY[/youtube]

So are these two Fuzz Faces germanium or silicon. I'm really impressed by how both of these sound. I wish I would have gotten a Fuzz Face back in like 1998 or so when I was just using one box... I would have been very happy.

So yeah... germanium or silicon in these? Wasn't expecting these modern builds to sound that good. Then again, I've bought a few pedals based on GMD's demos and they don't end up sounding as good when I play them!

C

CBA713 wrote:

mathias wrote:You can probably get someone to build you a silicon fuzzface for the price of a new mass-production pedal. Or build one yourself for less than buying one used.

Gearmanndude to the rescue, as usual, for what a Fuzz face sounds like:
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UchIXsX3OkY[/youtube]

So are these two Fuzz Faces germanium or silicon. I'm really impressed by how both of these sound. I wish I would have gotten a Fuzz Face back in like 1998 or so when I was just using one box... I would have been very happy.

So yeah... germanium or silicon in these? Wasn't expecting these modern builds to sound that good. Then again, I've bought a few pedals based on GMD's demos and they don't end up sounding as good when I play them!

C

The reference to the transistor is NKT275 germanium transistors. This is also what Analogman uses (used? I haven't kept up) in their Sunfaces. http://www.analogman.com/fuzzface.htm He's got some discussion on the transistors on there.

Personally I'm a fan of silicon because it's cheap, but germanium has the VINTAGE TOANS. And sounds a lot smoother (I'd rather own a Fulltone '69 than a Fulltone '70.. 70 sounds too harsh to my ears.)

The BC108 is a silicon transistor in a metal can, that is higher gain and not as smooth, but it gets more fuzzy. that's what MXR uses in their Classic 108 fuzz. It's actually a decent choice, to my ear.

I've heard "Silicon Fuzz Faces work better with Humbuckings and heavy strings, darker-sounding rigs." but I can't confirm or deny that.. just take it with a grain of salt.

While I'm on the subject: MJM London Fuzz is supposed to be great. It's a fuzz face of some sort and has lots of fans.

I know there are all sorts of discussions on Silicon & Germanium, but is it easy to spilt up fuzz boxes into those two categories just for simplicity's sake?

I have an Algal Bloom, US Fuzz, Merkin, and a Large Beaver. Hmm... thought I had more. Anyway... I'm pretty sure the Algal Bloom is silicon (I have one with a germanium choke and one without), and as far as I know, the US Fuzz is silicon-based, and the Merkin has a triple-silicon, uh, thing. Not sure about Large Beaver/Big Muffs. I think those are silicon, too. My guess is that most fuzz boxes are silicon-based because of the reliability and cost.

Again, I'm really surprised/impressed by the way those two Fuzz Faces sound. I looked a bit at Analog Man's Sun Face, but with the options that I put on it, it ended up being $260. No way. My guess that it would probably sound TOO good, you know?

C

CBA713 wrote:I know there are all sorts of discussions on Silicon & Germanium, but is it easy to spilt up fuzz boxes into those two categories just for simplicity's sake?

I have an Algal Bloom, US Fuzz, Merkin, and a Large Beaver. Hmm... thought I had more. Anyway... I'm pretty sure the Algal Bloom is silicon (I have one with a germanium choke and one without), and as far as I know, the US Fuzz is silicon-based, and the Merkin has a triple-silicon, uh, thing. Not sure about Large Beaver/Big Muffs. I think those are silicon, too. My guess is that most fuzz boxes are silicon-based because of the reliability and cost.

Again, I'm really surprised/impressed by the way those two Fuzz Faces sound. I looked a bit at Analog Man's Sun Face, but with the options that I put on it, it ended up being $260. No way. My guess that it would probably sound TOO good, you know?

C

You could always buy one used. Sunfaces pop up every once and awhile on B/S/T threads and quite often on eBay.

And yes, Algal Bloom is silicon.

maz91379 wrote:I'm fairly sure that different batteries like alkaline vs zinc make absolutely no fucking difference in a germanium fuzz face other than getting some sag laters based on my dreamcrusher .

viewtopic.php?f=151&t=16743
^if you want the fuzz battery debate