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I'm thinking about replacement speaker(s) for my Hot Rod 212: at least one Vintage 30 and maybe one something else (Greenback? Jensen something?). I'm trying to get a bit more low end out of it, especially with my POG. It often gets a little floppy with lots of low end, especially when it's hot.

Will speakers even make a difference? I've heard they're a huge factor in tube amp sound.

Am I wasting time and money?

Should I think about different speakers? Or maybe just get my amp modded?

Halp!

if it helps i had greenbacks in my vox and it didnt change the low end as in adding to it
the vox didnt really put out fat end in the first place


same situation for the fender prob
other amps will put out more low end and closed cabs

julius_deane wrote:I'm thinking about replacement speaker(s) for my Hot Rod 212: at least one Vintage 30 and maybe one something else (Greenback? Jensen something?). I'm trying to get a bit more low end out of it, especially with my POG. It often gets a little floppy with lots of low end, especially when it's hot.

Will speakers even make a difference? I've heard they're a huge factor in tube amp sound.

Am I wasting time and money?

Should I think about different speakers? Or maybe just get my amp modded?

Halp!

If you are looking for low end I don't think the Vintage 30 would be your best option.

You should be able to disconnect your current speakers by just unplugging them, your amp should also have an external speaker jack.
If you unplug the stock speakers and connect the external speaker jack to different cabs you should be able to get an idea of what it would sound like with those speakers. Guitar Center should have a good variety of cabs to sample, just make sure and match the ohms.

If I were you, I'd consider just getting a 212 extension cab. That way you would have the option of using the stock speakers, the extension cab or both as a 412.

If you aren't into the idea of an extension cab I would suggest http://www.eminence.com/guitar-bass/.

The Wizard(G12H30) and the GB128(Greenback) are both awesome. The Wizard has more Low end and the GB128 has more mids.

If you find one you like the cheapest place to buy them is http://www.jr.com/product/productListing.jsp?Ntt=emienance+guitar+speaker.

If you just have to have Celestions you can get them here http://www.avatarspeakers.com/, they are about $50 cheaper than Guitar Center. Check out their cabs too they are pretty awesome and not too expensive.

I'm going to shut the fuck up now.

MiddleEarthCrisis wrote:If you are looking for low end I don't think the Vintage 30 would be your best option.

You should be able to disconnect your current speakers by just unplugging them, your amp should also have an external speaker jack.
If you unplug the stock speakers and connect the external speaker jack to different cabs you should be able to get an idea of what it would sound like with those speakers. Guitar Center should have a good variety of cabs to sample, just make sure and match the ohms.

If I were you, I'd consider just getting a 212 extension cab. That way you would have the option of using the stock speakers, the extension cab or both as a 412.

If you aren't into the idea of an extension cab I would suggest http://www.eminence.com/guitar-bass/.

The Wizard(G12H30) and the GB128(Greenback) are both awesome. The Wizard has more Low end and the GB128 has more mids.

If you find one you like the cheapest place to buy them is http://www.jr.com/product/productListing.jsp?Ntt=emienance+guitar+speaker.

If you just have to have Celestions you can get them here http://www.avatarspeakers.com/, they are about $50 cheaper than Guitar Center. Check out their cabs too they are pretty awesome and not too expensive.

I'm going to shut the fuck up now.

Please don't! That was very helpful!

I believe my stock speakers are Eminence designed . . .

The wizard says it "has a bit of grit," which doesn't sound great to me, and the GB is only 50W.

I wonder what are in Jack White / Jamie Hince / Nick Zinner's cabs? Do pros change their speakers that often?

three words: low-frequency Greenbacks.

dubkitty wrote:three words: low-frequency Greenbacks.

What does that mean? Where do I find these?

I'm guessing that means GH-30's with the 55Hz cones. Which is either the Celestion Heritage UK-made reissues or a repro or workalike from Scumback or another maker.

If you really want to add bass, I'd tend towards something EV-ish. For new production there are the EVM-12L reissues in a couple flavors and Eminence Delta speakers are a popular work-alike. Some don't notice a substantial difference, some do and have a preference, but the preferences seem to go either way.

julius_deane wrote:
Please don't! That was very helpful!

I believe my stock speakers are Eminence designed . . .

The wizard says it "has a bit of grit," which doesn't sound great to me, and the GB is only 50W.

I wonder what are in Jack White / Jamie Hince / Nick Zinner's cabs? Do pros change their speakers that often?

Your right, the GB128, Eminence's version of the Greenback, is only 50w but you're going to be using 2 of them so the speaker unit will be 100w and your amp is only 60w so that's OK.
The Celestion Greenbacks are only 25w each for a total of 50w which would probably be OK but not Ideal.
The Wizard is Eminences version of the Celestion G12H30 (which I believe is the modern version of what DubKitty is referring to) but to me sounds better and is less expensive. Also, the Wizards are 75w each so your speaker unit would be 150w. You probably wouldn't get speaker break up unless you cranked the amp and then only a little. The G12H30's are 30w for a 60w total so you'll have the low end but with more break up.

There is also an Eminence version of the Vintage 30, I think it's the Private Jack or Governor as well as a lot of others.

If you really like the Celestions go for it. I just think Eminence makes a better sounding speaker at a better price and not that it really matters but Celestions are made in China and Eminences are made in Kentucky.

Celestions and Fenders just don’t belong together.

I would go with a either a Webber Michigan, like an EV SRO so there is little coloration, just the sound of the amp or a Chicago, nice breakup, old Jensen voiced speaker.

Didn’t like the sound of the Californias, which is voiced to emulate a JBL D140

MM

MiddleEarthCrisis wrote:Your right, the GB128, Eminence's version of the Greenback, is only 50w but you're going to be using 2 of them so the speaker unit will be 100w and your amp is only 60w so that's OK.
The Celestion Greenbacks are only 25w each for a total of 50w which would probably be OK but not Ideal.
The Wizard is Eminences version of the Celestion G12H30 (which I believe is the modern version of what DubKitty is referring to) but to me sounds better and is less expensive. Also, the Wizards are 75w each so your speaker unit would be 150w. You probably wouldn't get speaker break up unless you cranked the amp and then only a little. The G12H30's are 30w for a 60w total so you'll have the low end but with more break up.

Wait, I thought speaker wattage didn't stack that way. I thought, for example, 2 25W speakers = 25W, etc. But I don't get electrics. Barely passed that test in physics.

You guys have definitely opened my eyes (ears?) to a world of speaker options. I'm going to have to do more research.

julius_deane wrote:Wait, I thought speaker wattage didn't stack that way. I thought, for example, 2 25W speakers = 25W, etc. But I don't get electrics. Barely passed that test in physics.

You guys have definitely opened my eyes (ears?) to a world of speaker options. I'm going to have to do more research.

Yeah, speaker wattage adds up.
If you were to use two speakers with different wattage's the total would by double the lowest wattage of the two.

EX: If speaker A is 30w and speaker B is 50w the cabs total wattage will be 60w not 80w.

Ohms are the other thing you need to consider. Make sure the replacement speakers you get are the same ohm as the stock speakers.
Ohms get a little trickier when you start adding extension cabs.

metalmariachi wrote:Didn’t like the sound of the Californias, which is voiced to emulate a JBL D140
MM

I used to have a Fender 210 cab with JBL K110's, which I believe are the last series of Alnico mag speakers JBL made. Great clean but did not like dirt much -- super bright top end. I wish I had kept them around for the cleans, but they aren't do-it-all for me.

The extension cab worked perfect for me. I was using my Carr Slant 6V head with Carr 2x12 open back (Eminence RWB) and it got sloppy on the lows. I added 2x12 closed back Emperor with Weber 1265h clones and it's perfect. Super tight bass mixed with the airy openness of the open back, sounds huge but controlled now. Btw, using a POG2 and it does great with all the frequencies that thing puts forth.

Avoid V30s and Greenbacks if your looking for tighter lows, neither of those speakers excel at low end.

no one said fender bassman?

also, the mesa black widow or black shadow, I cant remember but it was in my combo open back and it was too much bass

Holy Schnikes wrote:The extension cab worked perfect for me. I was using my Carr Slant 6V head with Carr 2x12 open back (Eminence RWB) and it got sloppy on the lows. I added 2x12 closed back Emperor with Weber 1265h clones and it's perfect. Super tight bass mixed with the airy openness of the open back, sounds huge but controlled now. Btw, using a POG2 and it does great with all the frequencies that thing puts forth.

Avoid V30s and Greenbacks if your looking for tighter lows, neither of those speakers excel at low end.

Yeah, in my opinion the extension cab is the way to go. For a little more money you get a lot more options.