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I think the fact that it isn't interested in saying anything new is a massive mark against it. There's A LOT of TNG that is easily accessible. If you were gonna do a spiritual sequel to an old space opera, why would you pick the one with hundreds of eps over something like Firefly or Bebop or something? TNG + dick jokes would be a recipe for early cancellation if not for Seth's apparent immutability.

Yeah, The Orville is definitely a weird case. Especially since most of the positive buzz about it essentially amounts to "I thought it was going to be completely awful and it's not". I think I already said this previously, but I think the only reason I have watched all the episodes is it's the closest thing to a TNG style show out there. The people behind new Trek properties don't seem to have any interest in perpetuating the franchise or its themes, just using it as an available property. Not to say that means any new Trek output is inherently terrible or artistically worthless, it just seems like any artistic merit or interestingly explored new themes are going to be secondary to the fact that it's a property that's owned and can be developed with maximum control and minimal creative interference. If a studio/network bought an idea, they'd have to content with the creator and their vision/demands, as opposed to creative people trying to slip in interesting things into their part of making it. Much like all the superhero movies are right now.

Olin wrote: Tried season 4 of Black Mirror and I don't think I'll even bother finishing it. I really, really liked the first three seasons but so far this is overwhelmingly thin and corny. Fairly disappointed to be honest but I guess this means it's time to stop making it and let it die as a show that was at least mostly good.

I mostly concur.
I watched most of the episodes & went meh, skipped number 5
BUT ep4 and ep6



new Dirk Gently was rad!

The funny thing about The Orville is that, even though it appears that it wants to be TNG, it's really Voyager to the point that they directly copied some of their episodes.

ProCarsteNation wrote:

Olin wrote: Tried season 4 of Black Mirror and I don't think I'll even bother finishing it. I really, really liked the first three seasons but so far this is overwhelmingly thin and corny. Fairly disappointed to be honest but I guess this means it's time to stop making it and let it die as a show that was at least mostly good.

I mostly concur.
I watched most of the episodes & went meh, skipped number 5
BUT ep4 and ep6

It was all awful from start to finish imo. The dating app episode which people seem to like is just a rom-com with a vague, recycled sci-fi plot device and a happy ending suitable for a kids film. The final episode revolved around an idea that is completely stolen from a The Earth Explodes comic strip and never actually had a point. I think that's the issue with this season, there's never any point to any of it and it just ends up being a series of sub-par Twilight Zone episodes and none of the enjoyable parts of Black Mirror are present except as props or crutches to progress a plot which could get by just fine without them.

jrfox92 wrote:The funny thing about The Orville is that, even though it appears that it wants to be TNG, it's really Voyager to the point that they directly copied some of their episodes.

I'd say that Voy/orville both share the problem of "more TNG" when we have enough TNG already. Orville is basically third hand trek ideas and that's kind of how it feels at this point. If they could solidify the tone, make it less of a parody and more its own thing ("union?" Uuugggggg) and ditch the Norm Mcdonald slime monster/Sisko's girlfriend scenes, I reckon it'd be better.

My dad is OBSESSED with Norm McDonald and I'm pretty sure he's the only British person who's even heard of him.

Olin wrote:
It was all awful from start to finish imo. The dating app episode which people seem to like is just a rom-com with a vague, recycled sci-fi plot device and a happy ending suitable for a kids film. The final episode revolved around an idea that is completely stolen from a The Earth Explodes comic strip and never actually had a point. I think that's the issue with this season, there's never any point to any of it and it just ends up being a series of sub-par Twilight Zone episodes and none of the enjoyable parts of Black Mirror are present except as props or crutches to progress a plot which could get by just fine without them.

Can't really get behind awful, but
'tis true, the ending of ep4 would have been a million times better, had they at least left out the last scenes after the ladder.
But it got me thinking about what dating is/means, how we go about it as humans.
And after three episodes of "oh please" it was finally some enjoyable television.
As for the final episode...
no stealing, Penn Jillette is mentioned in the credits. (if that is even what you are talking about)
I actually liked the old timey Zoneesk vibe of that episode.
Nice way to give a nod back to the roots an round off the season.
Or perhaps preferrably the series, because if season 4 is any indication:
just like ep4, episode 6 and yes black mirror, too, should have ended earlier.


(OK upon further research: Penn Jillette probably was NOT what you were talking about,
but Earth Explodes is now on my readlist, thanks!
Did you mean this one:
http://www.earthexplodes.com/comics/114/
?
Because surely that idea has been around longer than 2011)

After avoiding it for months (years?) I'm finally working through the new MST3K. Avalanche and Beast of Hollow Mountain were pretty good, going to watch Starcrash next. I skip the host segments - they're awful. Even the originals could be dumb (seasons 3-6 mostly hit, everything else mostly miss).

ProCarsteNation wrote:Can't really get behind awful, but
'tis true, the ending of ep4 would have been a million times better, had they at least left out the last scenes after the ladder.
But it got me thinking about what dating is/means, how we go about it as humans.
And after three episodes of "oh please" it was finally some enjoyable television.
As for the final episode...
no stealing, Penn Jillette is mentioned in the credits. (if that is even what you are talking about)
I actually liked the old timey Zoneesk vibe of that episode.
Nice way to give a nod back to the roots an round off the season.
Or perhaps preferrably the series, because if season 4 is any indication:
just like ep4, episode 6 and yes black mirror, too, should have ended earlier.


(OK upon further research: Penn Jillette probably was NOT what you were talking about,
but Earth Explodes is now on my readlist, thanks!
Did you mean this one:
http://www.earthexplodes.com/comics/114/
?
Because surely that idea has been around longer than 2011)

I guess "awful" is relative and this stuff really did pale in comparison.

This is the strip I'm referring to though: http://img0.joyreactor.com/pics/post/co ... 820059.png
The original artist wasn't credited in any way whatsoever that I saw and the idea is so blatantly stolen that it's affected how I view the whole show a little bit.

Oh man The Good Place just won't quit. Glad it's back.

I thought last night's episode was kinda weak. But, I still love it.

nice! i liked the Good Place a LOT. is it streaming a season somewhere? or episode by episode right now?

sooooo...... does End Of The Fucking World get..... better? i'm 4 or 5 episodes (after they introduce the somewhat wacky pair of coppers). and it's a loooooot of slowwwwww.... kinda interesting bits? with very little payoff so far?

I think the slow episodic pacing is one of its greatest strengths. Films usually just blast through the emotional arcs of the characters to stick to a structure whereas TEOTFW, despite being the length of a long-ish film, has a completely different pacing. And yes, the ending is good.

blakestree wrote:I thought last night's episode was kinda weak. But, I still love it.

Yeah it's kind of like we get either a plot episode or a funny episode but I still love it and admire its commitment to flipping the table so frequently. As much as I don't care for GoT, at least it's made audiences comfortable with stories that tear down as much as they build up (except star wars fans, apparently).

We're getting an episode a week on Netflix

yeah, i'm okayyyyyy with slower pacing. i too love having the time to properly explore arcs and all.

it's not just the pace, it's just not very compelling so far. and mosssssst of that is probably because i can't stand either main character? she is boriiiiiiing and for the little bit of compelling elements for him..... as soon as someone tortures or kills animals, especially doggos and/or kits, i do not like them at ALL.

as i've gotten older, animal abuse hits me harder than when i was younger.

yet human torture/death/abuse bothers me less.

does that make me a bad person?

WOOT INTROSPECTION.

behndy wrote:she is boriiiiiiing and for the little bit of compelling elements for him..... as soon as someone tortures or kills animals, especially doggos and/or kits, i do not like them at ALL.

For a second, I thought you were talking about The Good Place and was like shiiiit, I haven't kept up with that show, apparently. Ted Danson must've taken a really dark turn.