ilovefuzz.com

Cooper has had the same problem since the old GenLoss and Outward runs, there are steps that could've been taken if he really wanted to. You don't have to go all Ayahuasca to just rein things in a little.

I like some of the updates, esp the separate Wet/Dry, though I don't like speed + depth being combined (though, then again, they don't have much range anyway on V1). The freeze is the best sounding part to me, but also not that different to my V1 in the loop of a Superego, so I dunno. If one shows up at a reasonable price I'll try it out and hope the switches don't pop. Definitely never reward flippers.

jirodreamsofdank wrote:

whoismarykelly wrote:

jirodreamsofdank wrote:Seems like a preorder list would be the best way to not have people get mad about one minute sellouts (when you know that's what's going to happen). From that Analogman pedal people wait years for to Cirklons, people seem to be pretty chill when they get to put their name on an orderly list.

Lists are a logistical nightmare. They take a massive amount of time to deal with because you have to track people down to get payment when you're ready to ship which can take days of work just sitting at a computer sending emails. You end up with a bunch of people no-showing for their slot after you give them 24 hours or whatever to pay. If you take deposits you end up with a ton of people wanting refunds at some point or moving so their address is wrong and they dont let you know. It also puts a lot more pressure on the builder if they have peoples money already when they might not deliver a pedal for months or a year depending on how many people preorder. Lists also balloon up to years of wait really quickly because tons of people throw their name in the hat and then lose interest a month later. The big drop most builders use works because they can just build pedals and then sell them in a cycle without all the administrative mess of trying to maintain an orderly queue. Its much better for the builder to do less admin stuff and more pedal building when possible.

Fair (though I'd think something as in-demand as a Generation Loss assuages a lot of that - you're never going to not sell through... unless the scarcity is the primary reason people buy coughcough).

If you go with the random drop method, though, the builder shouldn't play shocked at selling out/scalpers/people being mad. Live by hypebeast marketing, die by hypebeast marketing.

This isn't whether you sell through. Its how much time managing the list and contacting people to get their payment takes compared to just setting a release date and letting people buy at a pre-specified time. Lets say Tom sold 500 units the other day. Managing a list and invoicing 500 people when the pedals are ready is easily a week of work. Full on 8-10 hour days at a computer. Posting them for sale is a click and then you start printing shipping labels. Most of the folks who complain about the drop method just don't want to sit at their computer for 10 minutes at a specific time or they are attempting to order on a phone which will never be as fast.

The people who don't want to sit at their computer for 10 minutes (late morning on a weekday when a lot of people can't sit there and hit refresh over and over) aren't making money from it. Drudge work is part of running a small business - and I mean, people in all kind of industries (including musical gear) run waiting lists and preorders without it being the end of the world. I manage subscriptions and special orders for hundreds of people on a weekly basis and it's not that much drama.

Like I said, the limited get it now while it's hot F5 F5 F5 F5 drop method is fine (if distasteful) but don't (as Chase Bliss and Cooper have both done) then start whining about the responses to that. They're benefitting from the hyped-up drop model where buyers can watch a demo after sending them $300+, just own it. "Yes, my business model encourage scalpers, suck it."

On the one hand, drudge work is a part of any business.

On the other hand, if you can eliminate it (without necessarily laying off people because pRoFiT) then you can free up staff to do more make money stuff.

Scalpers/seconday gray markets are always gonna do what they do because deregulated capitalism. Shouting at Joel isn't going to change those things.

To paraphrase Ghandi, you can still at least protest practises you do not support by not supporting them. I am still able to simply not purchase the latest Yeezy Fuzz because let's face it, it's just a fuzz.

Now, expensive loopers bought direct from a boutique builder is where it's at! It's like the gear equivalent of buying fresh, organic vegetables right there at the farm. Just don't buy the one I'm looking at yet because I'm not sure how big the initial run will be...

I wonder whether or not any of the people who see their product being sold on for crazy money keep any of them back to make a bit more profit from.

I know Mr. Klon used to pass some pedals on to a "friend" who needed money, but maybe his friend gave some of the profits back (I have no evidence this was the case, just using it as an example of a builder knowing full well that someone close to him was making money off the hype) maybe it was all as he said.

I imagine it would be hard to see your product making lots of money for someone who has done nothing to "deserve" it, instead of it going into your own pocket.

It's the same with gig tickets etc. why not sell the tickets direct to the scalpers for above the face value and make more money ?

dubkitty wrote:to me, some of this phenomenon has crossed over from questionable to flat-out morally wrong. guess i'm not a capitalist.

Capitalism is not and has never been moral.

Nor is it really a free exchange of goods for services.It sells itself as such, but is
actually more like a parasitic pyramid scheme in which you only make money if
you have already made a lot of money for those higher up the ladder.

This is also the basis of the Art World (which has been all about money-laundering
for generations). Dealers prefer dead artists because that presents a nice story and
aura to the art to stoke demand and also keeps the supply limited.

OK. So much for the depressing stuff.

Tools are still tools. Art is still art. Music is still music. The way to circumvent
the grift is to buy tools direct from the person/people who make them and if you can't,
then avoid the markup-market. Outside of some forum sales that can be reasonable,
I try to buy from guitar shops that specialize in music gear and have musicians for
employees.

For the time being shows, and walking into shops is difficult, but it would be nice if
the lines of mutually beneficial connection were retained for the After-The-Pandemic Times.

I gravitated towards pedals as opposed to computer-based plug-ins because I find tactile interfaces
better for performing live. There are no live performances with audiences right now. So maybe...?

There's gotta be a way. A better way.

[algorithmic sequencer content]
wasn't remotely prepared for this post-kickstarter drop, but it has def renewed my interest

https://www.torsoelectronics.com/t-1

Tall Walls wrote:The new Generation Loss sold out in a minute, I guess. And some dealers are taking the flipping into their own hands, selling it new for $500. I feel bad that Cooper FX's Instagram post about the release was pretty much "Hey everyone, I'm sorry I put out a pedal."

Can we name and shame the dealers who did this? Because that makes me want to avoid any shop that runs that way.

Gone Fission wrote:

Tall Walls wrote:The new Generation Loss sold out in a minute, I guess. And some dealers are taking the flipping into their own hands, selling it new for $500. I feel bad that Cooper FX's Instagram post about the release was pretty much "Hey everyone, I'm sorry I put out a pedal."

Can we name and shame the dealers who did this? Because that makes me want to avoid any shop that runs that way.

Guitar pedal shoppe and wolf music had them up for 499.

Gone Fission wrote:Can we name and shame the dealers who did this? Because that makes me want to avoid any shop that runs that way.

Guitar Pedal Shoppe in MA and Wolf Music in TX are the ones that I know about.

Edit: On the positive side, Eclipse Music in West St. Paul MN opted to only sell them in person. They also have an Arcades and a couple of Outward V2s if anyone is looking.

Has anyone copped a Source Audio Ultrawave? They've been posting some pretty cool sounding patches on Instagram and it seems very capable of producing some extremely weird sounds, although the editor looks like something I would spend an afternoon with, come up with something almost cool, then put it aside for a few weeks and have to start learning it from scratch again.

If people would stop paying inflated prices then this would all go away, but plenty of people would rather pay an inflated price than put in the leg work to F5 and that encourages people. I am just shocked at how many people are willing to put in all that effort to skim like $20-50 profit off of a limited pedal release. I would think that there are so many other things that are easier and more lucrative to middle man than guitar pedals. This is why we can't have nice things. It's also surprising how surprised everyone still gets when the practice continues or gets worse.

It's often way more than $20-50. It's not uncommon for it to be double the price (see Pladask, Cooper, SSBS NoMem/Pretty Years, some of these CBAs etc). So, this is why it's somewhat lucrative and why people are drawn to it. Just sucks for the people who just love pedals and want to play with them.

^ going off Reverb price guide all the Gen Loss V2 flips have sold for over $500 (highest being over $900), so they're getting enough profit to justify the effort in this case.

There haven't really been that many scalpers, though. The demand is just ridiculous and people are getting really caught up in the anxiety/excitement of the whole limited drop thing. It's happening with so many builders right now.

UglyCasanova wrote:It's often way more than $20-50. It's not uncommon for it to be double the price (see Pladask, Cooper, SSBS NoMem/Pretty Years, some of these CBAs etc). So, this is why it's somewhat lucrative and why people are drawn to it. Just sucks for the people who just love pedals and want to play with them.

The irony being that many of those that sell for almost double are actually not all that hard to get if you are willing to sign up for a mailing list and actually try for the pedal at the onsale date/time. It takes maybe 10 minutes of your life to pay retail prices. I was always shocked watching montreal assembly stuff sell at inflated prices when he had stock on his site. It's as if people don't even bother to look if the builders have things available.