Pedal companies that outsource their builds?

General Gear Discussion - effects, synths, etc.

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PeterBregman
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Re: Pedal companies that outsource their builds?

Post by PeterBregman »

I've got lot's opinions on this topic since I've been on all sides (I've been a solder-monkey in an assembly & test role for an outsourced audio electronics company, I've been a pedal designer & builder, and I've been a designer who outsources my assembly).

Without diving into all my feelings on the topic, I'll just say that a lot of the movement towards the outsourcing has to do with market demand.

Back when I was building my (our) own pedals with Resonant Electronic Design, circa '08-'12, we were moving like 50 of each pedal a year, and at the time, people were giving us shit for charging $215. That's $215 for pedals that were hand drilled, and soldered, powder coated, laser engraved, tested both electronically and sonically by yours truly. Plus...these were original circuits (not clones) that took me a long time to develop (sorry, bitterness leaking out). Long-story-short, I wasn't making jack, and I was busting my ass. Those pedals probably should have been $400....but then no one would have bought them. I definitely couldn't afford to hire anyone to do assembly for me, but all the time I spent building pedals was time I couldn't spend designing new pedals. I got burned out, hard.

The market changed a lot after that. In ~2015, boutique pedals exploded, and all of a sudden, even small-ish builders were selling 500 of each pedal a year, not 50. Some were moving thousands of each. At the same time, customers were getting more comfortable with higher prices too. All of that created an environment for actual profitable business to form/develop. A lot of builders I knew couldn't keep up with demand. There were a lot of small business loans taken out to expand production capabilities. With all the new funds, business had basically two choices - hire a bunch of assemblers and buy tools/test equipment/work benches/ventilation, etc, etc (basically build a small factory), or find another company to do assembly for them. Early on, some builders (Cusack, WMD, Heavy, etc) went hard in the small factory direction, whereas others decided to find other people/companies to assemble for them. This really comes down to a business model decision, and shouldn't have any bearing on the quality of the pedals.

*Re-badging pre-made pedals from the far-east is an entirely different thing* ...and that's shitty. No buts about it.

These days, all of the stuff I'm involved in gets assembled by other people. The Collaboration Devices compressor was built by Cusack. They do good work. The HEQs (both 1 and 1.2) are all built by my buddy John who now has the solder-monkey job I used to have at Great River Electronics. By day he's building $2,000 pro-audio EQs and preamps, and at night he's building HEQs. Same solder, same hands.

Don't judge pedals or manufacturers too much on where/how they build their stuff. Logistics are a bitch, especially for a small business. Judge pedals on how well they're built and how they sound. :)*
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Re: Pedal companies that outsource their builds?

Post by Blood_mountain »

PeterBregman wrote:I've got lot's opinions on this topic since I've been on all sides (I've been a solder-monkey in an assembly & test role for an outsourced audio electronics company, I've been a pedal designer & builder, and I've been a designer who outsources my assembly).

Without diving into all my feelings on the topic, I'll just say that a lot of the movement towards the outsourcing has to do with market demand.

Back when I was building my (our) own pedals with Resonant Electronic Design, circa '08-'12, we were moving like 50 of each pedal a year, and at the time, people were giving us shit for charging $215. That's $215 for pedals that were hand drilled, and soldered, powder coated, laser engraved, tested both electronically and sonically by yours truly. Plus...these were original circuits (not clones) that took me a long time to develop (sorry, bitterness leaking out). Long-story-short, I wasn't making jack, and I was busting my ass. Those pedals probably should have been $400....but then no one would have bought them. I definitely couldn't afford to hire anyone to do assembly for me, but all the time I spent building pedals was time I couldn't spend designing new pedals. I got burned out, hard.

The market changed a lot after that. In ~2015, boutique pedals exploded, and all of a sudden, even small-ish builders were selling 500 of each pedal a year, not 50. Some were moving thousands of each. At the same time, customers were getting more comfortable with higher prices too. All of that created an environment for actual profitable business to form/develop. A lot of builders I knew couldn't keep up with demand. There were a lot of small business loans taken out to expand production capabilities. With all the new funds, business had basically two choices - hire a bunch of assemblers and buy tools/test equipment/work benches/ventilation, etc, etc (basically build a small factory), or find another company to do assembly for them. Early on, some builders (Cusack, WMD, Heavy, etc) went hard in the small factory direction, whereas others decided to find other people/companies to assemble for them. This really comes down to a business model decision, and shouldn't have any bearing on the quality of the pedals.

*Re-badging pre-made pedals from the far-east is an entirely different thing* ...and that's shitty. No buts about it.

These days, all of the stuff I'm involved in gets assembled by other people. The Collaboration Devices compressor was built by Cusack. They do good work. The HEQs (both 1 and 1.2) are all built by my buddy John who now has the solder-monkey job I used to have at Great River Electronics. By day he's building $2,000 pro-audio EQs and preamps, and at night he's building HEQs. Same solder, same hands.

Don't judge pedals or manufacturers too much on where/how they build their stuff. Logistics are a bitch, especially for a small business. Judge pedals on how well they're built and how they sound. :)*
Awesome feedback, I appreciate your post! I’d love to pick your brain sometime on component sourcing and trade!
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Re: Pedal companies that outsource their builds?

Post by Chankgeez »

Good perspective, Peter. :thumb:

Imagine the Klon Centaur in 1996. :whoa:
Blood_mountain wrote: I often think about the true origin of a lot of the products I buy, but find I rarely ask that question to myself about the effect pedals I have. I think it’s important to know. One of the things I’ve been thinking a lot about lately is the origin of all the components that go into creating an effect pedal, how they’re produced, under what conditions, etc. I would imagine there are components being produced in less than ethical conditions, which is shitty. I know the phone I’m typing this on is the same however. It’s unavoidable I guess.
Well, I think prior to WWII most electronic components for Western consumption were produced in the U.S./Europe. Then post-WWII production shifted to mostly Japan. Gradually now moved to China and other Asian countries where labor is cheaper. :idk: Definitely unavoidable to some extent or another.

As Peter mentioned, difficult to make a profit otherwise. :snax:
psychic vampire. wrote:The important take away from this thread: Taoism and Ring Modulators go together?
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