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popvulture wrote:I think speaking to the obsessive personality thing, that might be why Euro didn't appeal to me. Although I do have a lot of fun going down rabbit holes and experimenting with noise / discovering new sounds, I'm much more measured and planned when it comes to songwriting. I also am pretty melody-oriented, so I've always appreciated integrated keyboards etc.

I know people who go the west coast route give zero fucks about that, and it seems to me that those who enjoy making noise and drones, zoning out and getting lost really jibe well with Euro. I love that kind of music, but it's not typically what I make... I think I spent a lot of time lusting after the gear because it's so cool looking and malleable, but ultimately that lack of boundaries makes some tight-ass part of my brain nearly blow a gasket.

See I'm all about melody. My goal, besides the ambient, drone stuff, is to make it work in a more standard musical way mixing it into the post rock and post metal and noise pop and shoegaze I like to do. Not just in the breakdowns or intros or outros but throughout with layers of it mixed with guitar and synths and whatnot.... we'll see if I can accomplish that

Ruiner wrote:

popvulture wrote:I think speaking to the obsessive personality thing, that might be why Euro didn't appeal to me. Although I do have a lot of fun going down rabbit holes and experimenting with noise / discovering new sounds, I'm much more measured and planned when it comes to songwriting. I also am pretty melody-oriented, so I've always appreciated integrated keyboards etc.

I know people who go the west coast route give zero fucks about that, and it seems to me that those who enjoy making noise and drones, zoning out and getting lost really jibe well with Euro. I love that kind of music, but it's not typically what I make... I think I spent a lot of time lusting after the gear because it's so cool looking and malleable, but ultimately that lack of boundaries makes some tight-ass part of my brain nearly blow a gasket.

See I'm all about melody. My goal, besides the ambient, drone stuff, is to make it work in a more standard musical way mixing it into the post rock and post metal and noise pop and shoegaze I like to do. Not just in the breakdowns or intros or outros but throughout with layers of it mixed with guitar and synths and whatnot.... we'll see if I can accomplish that

I definitely started euro in a very drone, ambient, west coast mindset. But recently, I've actually been working pretty hard to learn some theory and incorporate more melody into my work. This definitely could have been a factor. And I don't mean to say euro is inherently unmelodic, but it definitely does cater a little better to drones

I wanted to get into modular. Planned a couple cases on modular grid. Fun fact...I loathe patch cables.

So pedals and "second hand" stand alone synths it is for me. I have an sq-1 for my synths. Fun fact...I really don't enjoy working with sequencers. I think all these things are awesome, would have bought a Metropolis, Rene, that ridiculous harvestman sequencer, all of them. Then I realized I just don't like working with them.

I love Euro and draw a lot of inspiration from it. That said with all the options and hands on nature you get a lot of tweaking but not always a ton of immediacy. Having a bunch of main parts hard wired is a good thing as opposed to patching a whole bunch of things together to get something so basic.

This is apples and oranges but (and somebody said this before me) get a cheap synth off eBay or Craigslist and through it through your pedals. World of sounds. DX 100 through a bunch of shit sounds rad. Volcano FM, Ensonique ESQ 1 (they're getting expensive again), Roland D 50 plus gear you already own equals awesome.

Good posts all around. I went through this circle with pedals super early on. I forced myself fairly early on to make a kind of jam board that had the essentials for what I like and need. After doing that I still did the collecting, but I knew it was kind of hollow. None of it really added to what I did musically. So, that's why I've been rocking such a simple pedal setup for so long.

The only thing left is my synth stuff. As far as that goes my sv-1, minilogue, and sample are all I need. I've picked up a couple of pedals and "toy" synths for portable fun times and adding some extra sounds to the synth setup, but I know I have to be careful or it's going to balloon into something awful. Realistically I shouldn't get any more pedals/synths, find a good sequencer/controller for the sv-1, and make my little euro-rack video system. But I know that's not going to be easy...

See I don't find it hollow at all. For all my tons of purchases, I use it and I record. The songs I make are musical but I LOVe throwing on even a single note that can make all the difference in the world (to me). I may use a pedal or several pedals for only one note or a small part but that ends up being my favorite part of the song. I just love textures and layers so much and I think incorporating this is going to work well for me but only time will tell.

As far as immediace of setup... totally get that. That's why I love that I will have my pedal board for when I just want to play or have ideas ready. On the other side I love the idea of starting from nothing and building this patch that will eventually just play on its own. Not to mention to draw creativity out in an entirely new way.

I'm stoked.

Ruiner wrote: As far as immediace of setup... totally get that. That's why I love that I will have my pedal board for when I just want to play or have ideas ready. On the other side I love the idea of starting from nothing and building this patch that will eventually just play on its own. Not to mention to draw creativity out in an entirely new way.

Feel the same way, I think I don't need much pedals to play guitar. I love to play clean with a little bit of reverb and delay and just strum chords a la BJM/RanchoRelaxo and just have fun.
The way I see eurorack is completely different, I want to start with nothing and buil something pretty complexe, or not, but in a more ''exploration'' way than guitar. I want to start something and see where it gets me.

Ruiner wrote:See I don't find it hollow at all. For all my tons of purchases, I use it and I record. The songs I make are musical but I LOVe throwing on even a single note that can make all the difference in the world (to me). I may use a pedal or several pedals for only one note or a small part but that ends up being my favorite part of the song. I just love textures and layers so much and I think incorporating this is going to work well for me but only time will tell.

As far as immediace of setup... totally get that. That's why I love that I will have my pedal board for when I just want to play or have ideas ready. On the other side I love the idea of starting from nothing and building this patch that will eventually just play on its own. Not to mention to draw creativity out in an entirely new way.

I'm stoked.

I get that. For me it feels hollow because I don't feel like I'm producing anything new, or different, or really any better than what I'd make with my simple setup? It feels like I'm just trying to force inspiration through trying new gear? I feel like roughly 90% of the really super duper cool pedal sounds I like I can usually approximate with my little 4-5 pedal setup. I love having that kind of immediacy, it keeps me from losing the inspiration I have when it strikes.

If it works for you, though, then you should do it! It's all about finding what works for you.

01010111 wrote:

Ruiner wrote:See I don't find it hollow at all. For all my tons of purchases, I use it and I record. The songs I make are musical but I LOVe throwing on even a single note that can make all the difference in the world (to me). I may use a pedal or several pedals for only one note or a small part but that ends up being my favorite part of the song. I just love textures and layers so much and I think incorporating this is going to work well for me but only time will tell.

As far as immediace of setup... totally get that. That's why I love that I will have my pedal board for when I just want to play or have ideas ready. On the other side I love the idea of starting from nothing and building this patch that will eventually just play on its own. Not to mention to draw creativity out in an entirely new way.

I'm stoked.

I get that. For me it feels hollow because I don't feel like I'm producing anything new, or different, or really any better than what I'd make with my simple setup? It feels like I'm just trying to force inspiration through trying new gear? I feel like roughly 90% of the really super duper cool pedal sounds I like I can usually approximate with my little 4-5 pedal setup. I love having that kind of immediacy, it keeps me from losing the inspiration I have when it strikes.

If it works for you, though, then you should do it! It's all about finding what works for you.

EVeRyThInG works for me.... that's the problem

01010111 wrote:It feels like I'm just trying to force inspiration through trying new gear? I feel like roughly 90% of the really super duper cool pedal sounds I like I can usually approximate with my little 4-5 pedal setup.

This could basically replace the TL:DR from my original post.

01010111 wrote:

Ruiner wrote:See I don't find it hollow at all. For all my tons of purchases, I use it and I record. The songs I make are musical but I LOVe throwing on even a single note that can make all the difference in the world (to me). I may use a pedal or several pedals for only one note or a small part but that ends up being my favorite part of the song. I just love textures and layers so much and I think incorporating this is going to work well for me but only time will tell.

As far as immediace of setup... totally get that. That's why I love that I will have my pedal board for when I just want to play or have ideas ready. On the other side I love the idea of starting from nothing and building this patch that will eventually just play on its own. Not to mention to draw creativity out in an entirely new way.

I'm stoked.

I get that. For me it feels hollow because I don't feel like I'm producing anything new, or different, or really any better than what I'd make with my simple setup? It feels like I'm just trying to force inspiration through trying new gear? I feel like roughly 90% of the really super duper cool pedal sounds I like I can usually approximate with my little 4-5 pedal setup. I love having that kind of immediacy, it keeps me from losing the inspiration I have when it strikes.

Absolutely agree with this and it took a while but I've given up on complicated pedals and complicated pedalboards because of this. At the end of the day I prefer shutting up and playing my guitar.

With euro at least so far I'm approaching in a very different mindset, more "let's see what happens if I do this" than "I have a musical idea how can I make the exact sound I want". I've found it quite fun and relaxing making drones and less melodic sounds for me to zone out to rather than fully integrating it into my recording. Ultimately I do want to record with it but I think it'll take a while to figure that out and that's cool because I still enjoy it for a slightly different purpose.

Some awesome discussion going on in here.

I've posted before but 2016 was my pedal year ...tried so much stuff...buy sell buy sell...had it in my head I needed 10-15 pedals for "versatility" and when I finally got there I was overwhelmed because I felt like I wasn't using them all enough which caused writers block.

I then realized I was basically trying to build modular w pedals lol. For me, in my limited time, synth is better for me in regards to ambient, drone, soundscapes, whereas guitar suits me more for rock, blues, etc....(though layering in guitar w synth is a solid plan)

Now? I have 4 pedals (plus some modeling stuff in Bias) and it feels great.

I'm hesitant to fully dive into Euro yet which is why I bought a Phenol to start instead of trying to do a small rack. I think there are some similarities between pedals/modules....but ultimately I think the "philosophy" is different as far as what I'm trying to create and how I want to work...but time will tell

your words speak to me mrnovember...finnaly understanding a few things about what's important for fun and what is enough.... so I can sit content and evoke commander fun and not dwell on more.

Here's a better explanation of why i'm integrating the two....

MOST modular artists it seems use it for techno, industrial, bleep bloop music, and a smaller portion do it for ambient and/or drones. It was the ambient/drone side of things that caught my attention. However, even here, the MAJORITY of ambient / drone artists all have a similar workflow and in turn, a similar sound at a very broad level. No doubt there are people doing very interesting things (field recordings mixed with modular, very few (it seems) integrating with guitar, etc). In the MAJORITY of cases it seems it is all one or the other. You're either modular or you're pedals. There are people mixing the two and bring the worlds together which is PART of what I want to do. Besides what i've said earlier in this thread, a big appeal is the ability to have sounds evolve and change WITHOUT using knobs or expression pedals and simply by setting your patch. Parallel processing is going to be very important to me because i want to retain the guitar sound first and foremost (of course this will depend on what kind of track i'm making or layer for that track but i mean this for my overall sound). I don't want to sound like a guitar turned into a synth. I don't want to use modular as some do to turn a synth into a guitar. Minimalism is key for me in a lot of this... which is funny cause it is modular afterall. Not minimalism in gear but in what is going on in a patch. It may be something as simple as taking the send/return on one of my delay pedals and having Clouds in that loop..... but within that loop having a very melodic and ryhthmic patch happening over the long repeats of my delay pedal s\to achieve something that is much more difficult to do with pedals.... not impossible by any means. I do a lot of this stuff already with pedals but i feel modular opens up a lot more possibilities. Not to say i won't create full tracks with modular and use pedals as secondary because that will happen as well. Aside from these methods I am all about layers and textures. Nothing excites me more about making music than when you come up with a sound or texture that is unlike anything you've ever heard before. Making layers under, over, parallel to the guitar is where it's at for me.

I don't think I'll ever have one standard workflow. While that makes things easier, I find myself more creative when I change workflows. As an example of mixing it all, i'll do something like create a drum track with DrumBrute, use Organelle through modular for one layer, use guitar for another layer, use a combination of two for another, use the Folktek Triad for a texture layer, process vocals through modular, create a bass line with Sub 37 through modular, run a field recording through modular for another layer and it goes on and on and on. That's just what brings me joy and ultimately, what I feel is, something a little different from the "norm" in these areas....... but this is ILF and not many people here are doing the "norm" of anything......... which is why i love this place!

I'm the pinnacle of excess when it comes to buying gear but it hasn't stifled my creativity or writing. If anything, it has helped me grow as an artist with a more unique vision and understanding of what it is I want out of this. Don't get me wrong... i'll always throw a guitar straight into my Verellen on the high gain channel and do the br00tz and i'll record things like that as well, but I think my gear purchases have ultimately helped define what kind of artist I will be. I'm SURE i would write more than i do with a 6 pedal pedalboard that never changed.... i'd probably play better because i wouldn't be fiddling with pedals and gear.... i'd probably have more songs out... but FOR ME, i wouldn't be as fulfilled as I am taking the route i've taken so far.

This whole modular thing is a test for me. I may end up hating it, which is fine, but in the meantime, i LOVE that i'm learning it. I think it'll help even if I drop it all and go back to strictly pedals. I enjoy the building blocks mentality of it. Anyways..... enough ramble. I'm gonna go buy a Triple Sloth now.

I was talking about this with Monkey Dancer the other day (and Spacelord and IM touched on this a little bit in our ILFcast) but I think a big reason why we're seeing so many people get into Euro right now is because there isn't an easy way to replicate what the Clouds does in a stomp box.

To explain a little bit: it's an effect that is very obviously "usable" to guitar/bass/stringed instrument people, especially compared to something like, say, the Maths (there's a reason these are the two most common modules on modular grid, after all). So you see that, and you go "oh, ok, this is fucking rad. Maybe there's more to this than bleeps and bloops and checking your iphone while your machine plays your set for you. I bet this sounds fucking killer with a guitar run into it." (spoiler: I'm sure they're right, because Clouds is fantastic)

But, for whatever reason, this hasn't translated (much that I've seen) into the Pittsburgh modular "pedalboard" thingy. Not sure why.

Also, not to toot my own horn, but:

Ruiner wrote:No doubt there are people doing very interesting things (field recordings mixed with modular, very few (it seems) integrating with guitar, etc).

D.o.S. wrote:I was talking about this with Monkey Dancer the other day (and Spacelord and IM touched on this a little bit in our ILFcast) but I think a big reason why we're seeing so many people get into Euro right now is because there isn't an easy way to replicate what the Clouds does in a stomp box.

To explain a little bit: it's an effect that is very obviously "usable" to guitar/bass/stringed instrument people, especially compared to something like, say, the Maths (there's a reason these are the two most common modules on modular grid, after all). So you see that, and you go "oh, ok, this is fucking rad. Maybe there's more to this than bleeps and bloops and checking your iphone while your machine plays your set for you. I bet this sounds fucking killer with a guitar run into it." (spoiler: I'm sure they're right, because Clouds is fantastic)

But, for whatever reason, this hasn't translated (much that I've seen) into the Pittsburgh modular "pedalboard" thingy. Not sure why.

Also, not to toot my own horn, but:

Ruiner wrote:No doubt there are people doing very interesting things (field recordings mixed with modular, very few (it seems) integrating with guitar, etc).

See, this gets me curious again. I've always been intrigued by the Maths, but I haven't checked out the Clouds. That's been the other daunting thing with Eurorack... ffs there's so much out there, feels impossible to get a foothold in terms of what to check out.

I will check out demos and probably get salty.