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qnn-mdfssr wrote:

waltdogg wrote:speaking from experience with my hellhawk, the loudness knob does effective attenuate the power without losing much tone at lower (bedroom) volumes. however, when playing in a live situation you need to really crank the amp usually to or past 12 o'clock to breakthrough the attenuation.

and yes, in terms of audible volume the difference brtween 50 and 100 watts is only 3dB which is hardly an audible difference. but with more power usually comes more headroom and bass reponse which tends to make people think 100 watt amps are *significantly* louder than 50 watt amps when all that's really happening is the amp has extra power to produce frequencies we can't hear but can feeeeeeel.

Good to hear about the loudness knob being as effective as it seems. It seems like the extra physical oomph 100w offer wouldn't be all that critical for me. I'm not playing any slam riffs really and since I'll be doing 80% of my playing at home, I think a 50w will be sufficient.

Actually, at home It'll be more than "sufficient"

Earplugs, awesome neighbours, and an unefficient 1x12, and you're good to go
If gnarly face melting toanz aren't your biggest concern when noodling at home, you can ofcours just tame the amp by turning back the volume of whatever dirt pedal you put in front if it

That was my faux-master volume method for a long time back when I had a '72 Marshall Super Bass and an Orange OR120 from the same era...

I don't thing the new amps will be wattage switchable, more that you can order them in whatever wattage you want.

DRodriguez wrote:I don't thing the new amps will be wattage switchable, more that you can order them in whatever wattage you want.

Yeah thats what Alex told me too, just available in 50/100/200 watts. It's a nice thing thats for sure. I have a sovtek mig50 and currently it rarely can ever go past 1 on the high channel and past 2 on the low channel. Its tough because I want to crank it but honestly I might go back to just connecting straight to my interface and playing like that.

It sucks but Apartment playing is a joke, and more than 5 watts is probably overkill haha. I want a science but while Im not in a gigging band, I tend to not be able to convince myself its worth it. Nice guitars sure, amps not really.

frigid midget wrote: As far a sheer volume goes, doesn't the 100 vs 50 watt difference actually translate to an utterly inaudible difference of just 3db?

But then you will need to ask people to come like 3ft closer too your amps in that basement gig.

50 is plenty unless you tune low AND play super-loud AND need lots of headroom. Even then, some 50w amps will be able to hack it. Tuned standard, I never felt like I had any wattage requirement at all - 20 would do fine. Now that I time down to B or C, I gotta admit that my Laney Pro Tube 30 (which is actually only 20 watts & runs 6v6s) doesn't always cut it, even with a 4x12. It's still loud, but the low end could be tighter. I think 50 would be fine.

frigid midget wrote:

qnn-mdfssr wrote:

waltdogg wrote:speaking from experience with my hellhawk, the loudness knob does effective attenuate the power without losing much tone at lower (bedroom) volumes. however, when playing in a live situation you need to really crank the amp usually to or past 12 o'clock to breakthrough the attenuation.

and yes, in terms of audible volume the difference brtween 50 and 100 watts is only 3dB which is hardly an audible difference. but with more power usually comes more headroom and bass reponse which tends to make people think 100 watt amps are *significantly* louder than 50 watt amps when all that's really happening is the amp has extra power to produce frequencies we can't hear but can feeeeeeel.

Good to hear about the loudness knob being as effective as it seems. It seems like the extra physical oomph 100w offer wouldn't be all that critical for me. I'm not playing any slam riffs really and since I'll be doing 80% of my playing at home, I think a 50w will be sufficient.

Actually, at home It'll be more than "sufficient"

Earplugs, awesome neighbours, and an unefficient 1x12, and you're good to go
If gnarly face melting toanz aren't your biggest concern when noodling at home, you can ofcours just tame the amp by turning back the volume of whatever dirt pedal you put in front if it

That was my faux-master volume method for a long time back when I had a '72 Marshall Super Bass and an Orange OR120 from the same era...

I was using the same method on my Acoustic 150 last night. Otherwise you can't really make the volume knob low enough.

maggot wrote:50 is plenty unless you tune low AND play super-loud AND need lots of headroom. Even then, some 50w amps will be able to hack it. Tuned standard, I never felt like I had any wattage requirement at all - 20 would do fine. Now that I time down to B or C, I gotta admit that my Laney Pro Tube 30 (which is actually only 20 watts & runs 6v6s) doesn't always cut it, even with a 4x12. It's still loud, but the low end could be tighter. I think 50 would be fine.

I have a baritone in B and my Washburn Renegade I keep either in E or D. I've never needed to play loud and I don't really like to anyway if I can help it. I'll ask Alex what he thinks as the time gets close.

getting down to c standard and i wouldnt use any less than 100-150 watts. i recall being absolutely devoured by a v-4b and 8x10 while i was using a 100 watt mig and a 4x12 with v30s, vintage fricking 30s. still couldn't hear myself.

the wattage in my experience is a measure of "how high the master volume goes before turning it up is basically just more distortion and compression instead of more volume". 50w will be PLENTY FUCKING LOUD for pretty much any gig imagineable. The difference is basically in the tone at that volume.

well yeah, amps are rated in terms of maximum clean power before distortion. a v-4 will put out a full clean 100 watts before overdriving.

waltdogg wrote:getting down to c standard and i wouldnt use any less than 100-150 watts. i recall being absolutely devoured by a v-4b and 8x10 while i was using a 100 watt mig and a 4x12 with v30s, vintage fricking 30s. still couldn't hear myself.

I hate that going-deaf-and still can't hear yourself feeling.

Part of the problem may have been your cabinet. Many of those 12" Celestions don't like the sub-75hz sounds that much. I don't play that loud, but I have to say that for B-standard baritone, I like playing through an Acoustic 150. Super-loud, plenty of headroom and the trem will trip you out. The G100Ts (not that great anyway, but the cab was so cheap!) in my 4x12 handle the low B OK when it's distorted, but can't quite handle the fundamental clean (especially if I knock it down to A). If I had my druthers I'd play through a 1x15 and a 4x10, like a bass player. On all of my setups, there's also a huge difference between a regular guitar tuned to C and a baritone tuned to B. That said, I was playing with a drummer the other day and could hear myself just fine on my Pro Tube 30 combo. The low end just didn't sound like I wanted it to.

Before I started tuning down, I could be loud as fuck on 15 watts and get a decent sound. The requirements increase exponentially the lower you go. OTOH, if you don't like to play loud, you don't need much wattage. Low end that sounds pleasingly crunchy tuned to E can sound like utter bullshit tuned to B.