ilovefuzz.com

Chankgeez wrote:I just watched the latest EQD Junk video & Brazilian dude turned me on to this company:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fs1pFFOmss[/youtube]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fs1pFFOmss

Nice. Reminds me a bit of my old Lovetone Meatball.

In a rare turn of events, the Internet guessed correctly. The Matriarch is an expanded, paraphonic revision of the Grandmother's semi-modular architecture.

https://www.moogmusic.com/products/matriarch

https://www.guitarcenter.com/Moog/Matri ... 0278273.gc

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZ3u7lv-lUw[/youtube]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZ3u7lv-lUw

Mono, duo, and 4-note paraphonic playability
Stereo analog delay with up to 700ms of stereo or ping/pong style repeats
256-step sequencer with up to four notes per step and 12 stored patterns
Arpeggiator with selectable modes (Order, Forward/Backward, Random)
Semi-modular analog synthesizer—no patching required
90 modular patch points for endless exploration
Expressive 49-note Fatar keyboard with patchable velocity and aftertouch
Four analog oscillators with selectable waveshape and hard sync per-oscillator
Full-range analog LFO with six selectable waveshapes
Dual analog filters with parallel (HP/LP), stereo (LP/LP), and series (HP/LP) modes available
Dual analog ADSR envelopes
Dual analog VCAs
Three bipolar voltage controlled attenuators with ring mod capability
2x4 parallel wired unbuffered mults
Additional simple analog LFO useful for adding modulation to delay, filters and VCAs
1/4" external audio input for processing guitars, drum machines, and more through Matriarch’s analog circuits
Stereo 1/4" and 3.5mm Eurorack level audio outputs

So, I could buy one Grandmother, or I could buy four used Mother32s and have full four voice polyphony, four lfos, four hp/lp filters, four mixers, more patch points, four envelopes and most of those features (except the delay).

Or, I could buy eight behringer craves and have almost double of everything.

...or free VSTs.

/DoSbot

The Grandmother is $899, which I'm still pretty tempted to buy to replace my Sub 37.

This new Matriarch is $1999 which seems like way too much for what it is. That's more than the Subsequent 37! I guess it is essentially an upgraded Subsequent 37, though. More paraphony, lots of patch points, and a delay. No presets though.

fever606 wrote:EHX Switchblade Pro... tryna get a bit of that Swiss Things fruit... $125

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_UoCX7sBSek[/youtube]

This could be an upgrade for my trusty Boss LS2, especially because of the True bypass thing.

If they chopped $700 off the price it’d sound about right. I’m not sure why adding features to synths scales prices exponentially. It’s very frustrating

01010111 wrote:If they chopped $700 off the price it’d sound about right. I’m not sure why adding features to synths scales prices exponentially. It’s very frustrating

I agree, it would definitely feel right around the $1299 price point. Then I'd actually consider buying it rather than a Grandmother or a Subsequent 37. At $1999, there's no way I'll even consider buying one.

01010111 wrote:If they chopped $700 off the price it’d sound about right. I’m not sure why adding features to synths scales prices exponentially. It’s very frustrating

No US manufacturer is going to design and sell 10+ individual modules, a large custom case, and a 4-octave CV/MIDI keyboard for under two-grand. Verbos, Pittsburgh, Make Noise, WMD---none of these companies could produce something like a Matriarch at $1,300. If they tried to, they'd be bankrupt in under a year.

echorec wrote:

01010111 wrote:If they chopped $700 off the price it’d sound about right. I’m not sure why adding features to synths scales prices exponentially. It’s very frustrating

No US manufacturer is going to design and sell 10+ individual modules, a large custom case, and a 4-octave CV/MIDI keyboard for under two-grand. Verbos, Pittsburgh, Make Noise, WMD---none of these companies could produce something like a Matriarch at $1,300. If they tried to, they'd be bankrupt in under a year.

I mean, if they weren’t tying to use a fatar that’s a few hundred that could be shaved off of their parts cost? If the ProOne had the same feature/price ratio, it’d easily cost over $10k? If you drop $2k on a modular system, why would you want buy something that can’t be customized?

Those other manufacturers you mentioned don’t benefit from the same economies of scale that Moog does. So, of course any equivalent product would cost more coming from them. It doesn’t matter how you slice it, that price doesn’t make any sense.

01010111 wrote:Those other manufacturers you mentioned don’t benefit from the same economies of scale that Moog does. So, of course any equivalent product would cost more coming from them. It doesn’t matter how you slice it, that price doesn’t make any sense.

So people should be upset with Moog for overcharging, even though by your own admission, no one else would be able to produce a similar product more cheaply...That's great debating, W.

echorec wrote:

01010111 wrote:Those other manufacturers you mentioned don’t benefit from the same economies of scale that Moog does. So, of course any equivalent product would cost more coming from them. It doesn’t matter how you slice it, that price doesn’t make any sense.

So people should be upset with Moog for overcharging, even though by your own admission, no one else would be able to produce a similar product more cheaply...That's great debating, W.

Pretty much? If Hershey’s decided to start charging $15 for a chocolate bar people should be pissed. Just because some boutiquey chocolate maker can’t make chocolate at the same cost structure, that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be upset that Hershey’s is artificially inflating their price?

The only reason they can defend charging this much for a product that should by all means cost far less is because they’re operating under a quasi-monopolistic strategy (no one else makes Moog).

Y'all are smoking crack if you think the Matriarch is a Grandmother + $300 of upgrades.

The architecture essentially makes it Moog's version of the Korg Mono/Poly (mono/duo/quad paraphonic with a sequencer and an arp that can cycle through voices, each of which can have their own waveform/octave settings), with stereo filtering (2 peaks) and stereo analog delay built in. It's quite a different synth than the Grandmother, and even more different than the Sub37.

Obviously it'd be great if it was cheaper, but $2k isn't nuts for this IMO, especially considering the Pro 2 retails for $2k. Obviously both have different feature-sets, but in terms of architecture it's probably the closest synth you'll find on the market (unless you get a vintage Mono/Poly like I did, which can cost up to $2500 for one in good condition, freshly serviced). It has 3x as many patch points as the Grandmother FWIW.

Despite Moog's popularity, it's still a small company. They had 62 employees in 2015. Obviously it has grown since then, but I'd be surprised if the count was close to or over 100.

I'll happily pay the Moog tax tbh. Give me the Fatar keys because fuck a bad keyboard. Cutting costs on keyboards is lame considering the race to the bottom can't be beaten, Behringer will always win.
When the alternative is buying something from an unoriginal psychopath's manufacturing city with inhumane working conditions, the choice is simple for me. (With the exception of a Pro One, Jupiter 8, and/or Arp 2600 reissue, I'll probably buy that lol.)

Arturia announced Collection 7 yesterday, which includes a Mellotron and a Synthi emulator. I've been trying to download the Synthi, but Arturia's server is at a crawl.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiYYohqKnks[/youtube]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiYYohqKnks

Circling back to Moog, their synths and apps are discounted for Moogfest. I finally got the Model 15 and Model D, and I'm loving them so far.

Muse FTW wrote:Y'all are smoking crack if you think the Matriarch is a Grandmother + $300 of upgrades.

The architecture essentially makes it Moog's version of the Korg Mono/Poly (mono/duo/quad paraphonic with a sequencer and an arp that can cycle through voices, each of which can have their own waveform/octave settings), with stereo filtering (2 peaks) and stereo analog delay built in. It's quite a different synth than the Grandmother, and even more different than the Sub37.

Obviously it'd be great if it was cheaper, but $2k isn't nuts for this IMO, especially considering the Pro 2 retails for $2k. Obviously both have different feature-sets, but in terms of architecture it's probably the closest synth you'll find on the market (unless you get a vintage Mono/Poly like I did, which can cost up to $2500 for one in good condition, freshly serviced). It has 3x as many patch points as the Grandmother FWIW.

Despite Moog's popularity, it's still a small company. They had 62 employees in 2015. Obviously it has grown since then, but I'd be surprised if the count was close to or over 100.

I'll happily pay the Moog tax tbh. Give me the Fatar keys because fuck a bad keyboard. Cutting costs on keyboards is lame considering the race to the bottom can't be beaten, Behringer will always win.
When the alternative is buying something from an unoriginal psychopath's manufacturing city with inhumane working conditions, the choice is simple for me. (With the exception of a Pro One, Jupiter 8, and/or Arp 2600 reissue, I'll probably buy that lol.)

Lots of good points here. I especially agree with preferring better quality parts for a slight mark-up. I still couldn't see myself paying $2k for a Matriarch, though.