let's list every Rat clone (and also just chat Rats)

[BoatRich]

I bought a 90’s big box reissue RAT recently and it’s my favorite thing ever into anything Marshally, also it fucking rips on bass. Has anyone tried the Fat RAT thing they did recently? Curious about 18v and the bass mod.

[Jero]

I know at least one or two people got one (Fat Rat)...Seems like it'd be worth trying to mod one to that spec before spending the extra $100.

[qersty]

I know at least one or two people got one (Fat Rat)...Seems like it'd be worth trying to mod one to that spec before spending the extra $100.

Probably just the ruetz mod or coupling caps, mosfet is cool but i think for $100 extra theres probably nicer rats out there. There are some really weird rats proco made in the 90s called shredder and roadkill rat (i think? maybe some more) that had more clipping diodes and a big muff tone knob i wanna try

[mcatano]

I’m pretty sure the roadkill is the same pedal as the brat in a different, similarly cheap enclosure. I don’t think they sound any different than an actual rat, they’re just more plastic and the brat has the benefit of being very pink.

I’ve never heard of the shredder - proco definitely made some weird stuff. Solo rat, dirty rat, the rackmount double rat...

[BoatRich]

I know at least one or two people got one (Fat Rat)...Seems like it'd be worth trying to mod one to that spec before spending the extra $100.

I work at a ProCo dealer and cost is pretty low on those so it’s more the “will 18v and MOSFET sway my opinion on my big box RI” but that’s fair honestly. There’s a ton of cool rat options out there.

[qersty]

I’m pretty sure the roadkill is the same pedal as the brat in a different, similarly cheap enclosure. I don’t think they sound any different than an actual rat, they’re just more plastic and the brat has the benefit of being very pink.

I’ve never heard of the shredder - proco definitely made some weird stuff. Solo rat, dirty rat, the rackmount double rat...

I think actually it is the solo I'm thinking of. Got it confused with that Marshall shredder pedal

[Jero]

I know at least one or two people got one (Fat Rat)...Seems like it'd be worth trying to mod one to that spec before spending the extra $100.

I work at a ProCo dealer and cost is pretty low on those so it’s more the “will 18v and MOSFET sway my opinion on my big box RI” but that’s fair honestly. There’s a ton of cool rat options out there.

In that case, get one for me while you're at it

[ck3]

Finally had some quality time this weekend with a newly-acquired You Dirty Rat and was able to conduct direct comparisons with a Valeton Darktale, Earthbound Audio V3 Iron Pig, Yellowcake Furry Burrito, and Little Bear R.attack. The Proco likely has a different OpAmp than its current LM308-based counterparts based on differences in overall feel, i.e., significantly tighter, brighter, and crunchier at low to moderate gain (in a delightfully oh-so-80's shreddy way). Gain and filter tapers also vastly deviate from those of the R.attack's "Dir" mode. There is still plently of explosive doom fuzzstortion possible near max gain, though. I'd be curious to hear what a different OpAmp could achieve, though the Little Bear "Dir" setting is probably the same circuit with an LM308.

[Jero]

I may be wrong but I think the Little Bear uses different pots and other values in various places

[new05002]

the VT has become so far from the default RAT scheme I almost hardly think of it as a RAT. Since I have started making the Super VTs its almost just an LM308 distortion rather than a modded RAT. The 125Bs were darker then the original run of VTs due to the mid control and thats why it sounds darker than the other 3 pedals in that video. I did a few mods to people who had them to decrease the high cut that was present due to the mid control.

[Snufkino]

Picked up a R.Attack on ebay that arrived today to compare to my late 80's 'blackface' rat. In short, after a quick play, it doesn't stack up but is fine for a distortion pedal.

Pros: Way more volume, more versatile with the extra modes. Little to no background noise.

Cons: Not as densely textured gain. Kind of dark. Distortion pot taper is garbage. Noon seems like max gain, pushing it beyond that doesn't seem to add anything. Tricky to dial in low gain. A real Rat needs to double as a potential murder weapon. I would only trust this lighter enclosure to maim.

The actual stock, 'Vintage' Rat sound is it's weakest point. The Dirty adds another two silicon diodes so it's low on volume but has a smoother, warmer tone which is nice. Turbo LED is quite dynamic and actually suits the overall less dense/textured tone. I'll have to compare it to my Deucetone.

The Proco likely has a different OpAmp than its current LM308-based counterparts based on differences in overall feel, i.e., significantly tighter, brighter, and crunchier at low to moderate gain (in a delightfully oh-so-80's shreddy way).

That's exactly how I'd describe the stock Rat to the R.Attack, and both of mine have an LM308, (but the R.Attack's is potentially dubious ). so if your Rat sounds like mine, and doesn't have the 308, then that certainly goes some way to proving what I've always thought, the 308 isn't the sole source to the magic.

Gain and filter tapers also vastly deviate from those of the R.attack's "Dir" mode. There is still plently of explosive doom fuzzstortion possible near max gain, though. I'd be curious to hear what a different OpAmp could achieve, though the Little Bear "Dir" setting is probably the same circuit with an LM308.

The R.Attack's IC is socketed and I have a few different chips lying around so I might do some experiments later. Might even trace the circuit is there's nothing online, and if I can be arsed. I'll need to dismantle it anyway to see what if the gain pot is linear or log.

It's an odd pedal. It looks cheap, but is a hand-populated circuit, neatly wired with ribbon connectors. (A few heat marks on the foot switch board though) I got it for about £40 and I think new price is about £75 which is arguably fine, but personally I think it's a little much because it does look cheap. Stupid reason, but there you go. On the other hand, if it was just the turbo or dirty mode in a fancy enclosure, the price would be more justified, and people would probably think it was the bees knees.


In conclusion: If you want rat-like tones but aren't a purist, and want the versatility of a warm, fairly dynamic distortion, then you can't go wrong for the average used price.

[Snufkino]

So I stuck an OPO7 in the R.Attack and A/B'd it with my OPO7 Deucetone and it still sounds the same. Darker, less densely textured. No magic in the LM308 in this case. In turn, the Deucetone is only a hair different sounding than my LM308, and that's only really at lower gain.

I was wrong about the diodes in dirty mode, it's 2x germanium 1n60's. The casing is identical to the 4148 's which made me assume it was just adding another 2 diodes into the mix. I didn't really bother comparing but I think the 1n60's suit the overall darker tone a little more than the SH70's do in the Deucetone.

All pots are 100kB Linear, not 100kA Log as they "should" be. Most evident in the volume since it gets loud very quickly rather than having a smooth taper.

Some values are different in the R.Attack. The most likely to affect the tone are the ones in the clipping stage, coming off the distortion pot:

C5 2u2 = 1uf
C6 4u7 = same
R4 47ohm = 110ohm
R5 560ohm = 430ohm

R4 is the "ruetz" mod resistor. It would explain the difference in tone, but I'm not sure why it seems to get high gain really quickly. Probably just because it's a linear pot than a logarithmic. Odd choice (to save a few pence per unit?) that I think is to the detriment of the pedal.

The only other changes that might alter the tone at a stretch are C3, which is 47pf, not 30pf and C12 "should" be ceramic for whatever reason, but it's just metal film here. R10 is 180ohm instead of 47ohm, so it might be enough to affect voltage getting to the circuit.

As for the huge amount of volume, I think it's achieved just by wiring the volume pot differently. It looks like it's connected to the Gate of the mosfet rather than the Source...? It's a double layer board so I can't tell 100%. There's no extra boost circuitry at all. Mosfet is K30A. Might look into that if I ever make my own Rat circuit.

[qersty]

The changes in the power supply shouldnt affect tone, it is probably changing the current draw to get less noise (since the original rat is designed for batteries). c3 should be a biggie tho as i understand it changes the slew-rate. Also it may be so that they use counterfeit ICs which seems quite common.

[Chankgeez]

Rat 2, but never 2 Rat?



https://reverb.com/item/22599923-proco- ... 1997-black

[Jero]

it changes the slew-rate.

https://reverb.com/item/22599923-proco- ... 1997-black

I don't care about slew